Map drops - assessment of 2.0.0, and changes coming in 2.0.2

ok so I spent this evening since the patch running high maps, all of them chiseled, alched, chaosed to 100%, 3 sac pieces and a 10c zana mod on every one of them, and the maps I got back were pretty much a joke.

I dont see any real difference between spending that amount of currency and just running them white tbh, if I had ran them all white I feel like it would be pretty 50/50 if I got more or less maps back, I was running 150% quant maps and getting literally 0 map drops from them, run another and get a -1 and a -6, another and get a +1 and a -5...

I dont see any reason to really invest in maps. Your system doesnt work, theres no observable difference, no risk vs reward. Maybe for people like you guys who dont actually run maps and all you do is look at server stats then u see some sort of difference when looking at 500,000 maps run over a month, to the player it seems like fuck all difference between extreme investment and virtually no investment. Every time you make a big change we all start investing, and then we work out a little while later its a total joke and doesnt rly make a difference, go back to just alch and go or maybe chaos the map simply to make it easier.

As far as Im concerned your map system is a failure, 95% rng, 5% investment at best, complete waste of time and resources. If you want to invest in maps, buy maps from other players, thats the only way to spend currency on maps that matters.

2.5 years and your map system is still a total farce. Well done.

"

Snorkle_uk wrote:

ok so I spent this evening since the patch running high maps, all of them chiseled, alched, chaosed to 100%, 3 sac pieces and a 10c zana mod on every one of them, and the maps I got back were pretty much a joke.

I dont see any real difference between spending that amount of currency and just running them white tbh, if I had ran them all white I feel like it would be pretty 50/50 if I got more or less maps back, I was running 150% quant maps and getting literally 0 map drops from them, run another and get a -1 and a -6, another and get a +1 and a -5...

I dont see any reason to really invest in maps. Your system doesnt work, theres no observable difference, no risk vs reward. Maybe for people like you guys who dont actually run maps and all you do is look at server stats then u see some sort of difference when looking at 500,000 maps run over a month, to the player it seems like fuck all difference between extreme investment and virtually no investment. Every time you make a big change we all start investing, and then we work out a little while later its a total joke and doesnt rly make a difference, go back to just alch and go or maybe chaos the map simply to make it easier.

As far as Im concerned your map system is a failure, 95% rng, 5% investment at best, complete waste of time and resources. If you want to invest in maps, buy maps from other players, thats the only way to spend currency on maps that matters.

2.5 years and your map system is still a total farce. Well done.

Agree here, what did you guys really do? buffed maps drop rate from 1% to 1.1% and called it a day?

"

Snorkle_uk wrote:

ok so I spent this evening since the patch running high maps, all of them chiseled, alched, chaosed to 100%, 3 sac pieces and a 10c zana mod on every one of them, and the maps I got back were pretty much a joke.

I dont see any real difference between spending that amount of currency and just running them white tbh, if I had ran them all white I feel like it would be pretty 50/50 if I got more or less maps back, I was running 150% quant maps and getting literally 0 map drops from them, run another and get a -1 and a -6, another and get a +1 and a -5...

I dont see any reason to really invest in maps. Your system doesnt work, theres no observable difference, no risk vs reward. Maybe for people like you guys who dont actually run maps and all you do is look at server stats then u see some sort of difference when looking at 500,000 maps run over a month, to the player it seems like fuck all difference between extreme investment and virtually no investment. Every time you make a big change we all start investing, and then we work out a little while later its a total joke and doesnt rly make a difference, go back to just alch and go or maybe chaos the map simply to make it easier.

As far as Im concerned your map system is a failure, 95% rng, 5% investment at best, complete waste of time and resources. If you want to invest in maps, buy maps from other players, thats the only way to spend currency on maps that matters.

2.5 years and your map system is still a total farce. Well done.

I cant comment on the actual drop rates of maps post-patch, only run 2 or 3 maps before going to work, but I share Snurkle's sentiment about them. It is a sad moment when you realize it is better to run mid-tier maps in a "first-alch-drop-and-go" style and invest saved currency to buy more maps from other players. Why spend 10+ chaos on a map when you can buy 2 or 3 maps of higher level for that price?

The fact that map issue that generated hundreds of pages of feedback got a single line in the patch notes is infuriating. Even more so when despite all the discussion and feedback, only thing is change is an obscure number hidden behind curtain, aka % drop rate, that should magically fix map drops. No details shared on such "improvement" in good GGG tradition.

This band-aid solution ignores issues with significantly lower map dropping in high level maps. The system still feels too reliant on RNG where players can not make clear connection between invested currency and maps returned.

I plan to throw myself at 74+ map range this weekend, I have saved all those maps and large amount of 73s for the patch. I sincerely hope GGG increased drop rates enough to make a difference for a player. If not, I will go back to leveling my 2 other characters to lvl82 for a challenge. Once done, I might take a break from PoE to prevent severe burn-out.

"

NBlackLotusN wrote:

Agree here, what did you guys really do? buffed maps drop rate from 1% to 1.1% and called it a day?

you might be half joking there, but thats literally what theyve done I think.


You know what 150% quant on a map buys you? a map that crashes, thats your return on investment, a map you cant even go back in to if u were careless enough to drop a port near a loot pile.

I spent over 100 chaos of currency on maps last night and what I got back was less than I would have got if I ran them white and then bought maps with the chaos. You know how I know that 100% for sure? Because the maps I got back were worth under 100 chaos combined, that means if I dropped 1 single map in all those white maps I would have had more returns on my investments than I actually got from running -max extra as lightning vulnerability horrific maps. Now if its not worth investing in lvl78/79 maps tell me what level of maps I have to be running where spending a single chaos orb on them is worth it? Because its obviously something higher than 78/79.


Its like fusing with quality, spend 20 fusing on a 6 socket how many 6 links did u get? spend 20 fusing on a 6 socket with 20%q each time how many 6 links did u get? Same answer, 0 for both. If you spend 30,000 fusing at 0q and then 30,000 at 20q maybe you will be able to observe the benefit of using quality in a consistent fashion. Thats how maps are, run 3,000 maps at 150%q and yeah Im sure you can notice u got more maps, sadly what you will have spent on those maps could have bought you at least as many if not more and you are still a bloody mug for spending a single chaos on a map you could have run from just the alch.



Someone remind me why I even waste my time posting any feedback on this stupid game? I dont even know why Im still playing it quite frankly.

Buffing the drop rate of 74,75,76 doesn't address any of the underlying problems with the map system.

edit,deleted.

Just adding to the general disappointment of the post patch map issues. Comparing this morning to any day in the last month, my drops have got worse.

I've done a 3hr mapping session from 75s to 78s and it seems about the same to me. Some garbage rolled 60% dropped a ton of maps and I "even" got a 79 out of a 142% Springs, but mostly it's just -2 to -5 drops...

In most cases I run 100%+ maps, which are noticeably more difficult than 60% maps, but the returns are the same.

GGG, mapping is still a senseless mess, because:

* too wide RNG variance in drops
* you over-nerfed cartoboxes (practically non-existent now)
* you totally nerfed exiles, beyond bosses, invasion bosses...
* you made Zana 8 useless
* map drops depend more on hidden parameters (seed) than parameters under player control
* map quantity = difficulty, does not influence the quality of maps dropped (see first point)
* there's way too much temporal chains & ice ground bullshit
* bugs leading to DC's & crashes

A system with great potential to deliver that difficulty-based progression ARPG fans love, messed up by weirdo economy-centric design invented by people who played D2 as a trade simulator. GGG, your shiny new offices need more ARPG players and less monopoly & gambling enthusiast.

"

morbo wrote:

I've done a 3hr mapping session from 75s to 78s and it seems about the same to me. Some garbage rolled 60% dropped a ton of maps and I "even" got a 79 out of a 142% Springs, but mostly it's just -2 to -5 drops...

In most cases I run 100%+ maps, which are noticeably more difficult than 60% maps, but the returns are the same.

GGG, mapping is still a senseless mess, because:

* too wide RNG variance in drops
* you over-nerfed cartoboxes (practically non-existent now)
* you totally nerfed exiles, beyond bosses, invasion bosses...
* you made Zana useless
* map drops depend more on hidden parameters (seed) than parameters under player control
* map quantity = difficulty, does not influence the quality of maps dropped (see first point)
* there's way too much temporal chains & ice ground bullshit
* bugs leading to DC's & crashes

A system with great potential to deliver that difficulty-based progression ARPG fans love, messed up by weirdo economy-centric design invented by people who played D2 as a trade simulator. GGG, your shiny new offices need more ARPG players and less monopoly & gambling enthusiast.

+1 to this guy.

One of the problems is monster density. If the map has low monster density, even if you roll +150 iiq and pack size, it will not drop anything. Certain map levels have more of these maps and people are getting stuck on them regardless of drop rate.
You need to either increase drops in such maps or increase the amount of monsters in them.