Delve - Not fun, rewarding, or challenging

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postrach_myszy wrote:

Form me, Delve is even worse then Bestiary. Literally, there are few things good in this league, but they have nothing to do with mines. I like Zana’s mission change, I like opportunity to spawn Harbingers on map, I really like “Shapers strongholds” idea. I like opportunity to get some items from previous leagues too.

But everything related to the mines is boring, tedious and discouraging to continue playing. It could be really good, however, the endless chase for sulshit and azushit, in combination with idiotic darkness, killing in seconds, right after blocking the characters by immortal monsters is just horrible, not to mention such extreme foolishness as flares and dynamite. And cherry at the top of stupidity - separate mines for each character. Really? I decided to skip all mines after reaching depth 100 and I will not visit them never again, until sulshit and azushit will be removed.

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Fallen_Enigma wrote:

An "infinite ledge" has been thrown around by certain PoE players. It sounds amazing. Delve is clearly an attempt at this, but some how this simple idea of an infinite ledge was made over complicated and simultaneously dull/tedious.

A handful of leagues ago I started doing 36/40 challenges, however for this league I simply cannot.

Delves are incredibly slow, boring, uneventful, unrewarding, not challenging, etc.

Sulphite:
The groups pushing high tier delves say that their main issue is Sulphite, not the difficulty of the Delve.

At the low end, the Sulphite cap is ridiculous. 1-3 maps causes u to cap, making you constantly load and unload areas which is a nightmare for slower computers, as well as tedious. As RaizQT said, he likes mapping, he likes Delving, but having to constantly switch between the two isn't fun.

Why is there a cap on Sulphite?

Bugs and Crashes:
Delve has been plagued with crashes, and I still have the same crash since the start of the league: Sometimes Azurite level 2 rooms cause the client to instantly crash when the loot starts dropping.

Azurite is basically essential to progress in Delve, so crashing at the only source of it... One of the reasons I'm quitting.

However, this isn't the only crash, far from it. Each patch has many crash fixes related to Delve, and while trying to duo, my partner crashed when I threw a flare/dynamite (not sure which, I tend to throw both on walls, this happened multiple times).

Flares and Dynamite:
Feels like no one really tested this properly, a large rework had to be done to flares and dynamite on release, and even still they feel bad.
Who the hell would use dynamite against monsters? Doesn't the monsters life cap at t16?

Therefore, Dynamite should be clickable on walls and that's it. It feels incredible awkward trying to hit 6 and 7 on the keyboard while getting hit by darkness and immortal mobs.

Fossil Crafting:
Unstackable currency?
Over complicated crafting that only 1% of the community will use?
There's enough stash clutter without these. Not going to buy 10 tabs like I've seen SOLO SELF FOUND players use just to store fossils. Most likely there's going to be a convenient fossil stash tab for sale once this gets approved for core.

Having to price each fossil was not fun when I sold off my collection, let alone sort through all of them spread out randomly in a random tab.

Rewards:
Sure, I made a respectable amount from sell mid tier fossils, but I could of made similar amounts mapping. I've heard very high levels is rewarding... but .0001% of the player base in a dedicated 6 man group having access to that level of rewards is not feasible for pretty much all of us, considering when I tried to duo one of us ended up crashing every time.

Aside from fossils, and level 500 depths currency rooms or whatever they're doing, Delve rewards feel horrible. It's like incursion events... but longer to do and 1/5th of the reward.

Progression:
Delve is incredibly slow to move forward, especially when trying to focus on ATTEMPTING to completing the challenges.

The "catch up" mechanic is a joke, forcing you to desperately hunt for Azurite rooms instead of progressing (as someone new to Delve, upgrades aren't as important once you get use to how things work).

Why can't we move past rooms? I literally don't give a fly f able non-azurite rooms, why do I have to stop there, click some grave, and wait 30 seconds for 1 pack of monsters to spawn from the ground?

Trying to get to floor 300 was terrible, I couldn't do it. It was so dull and boring and unchallenging as said at the beginning. Just throw me at 250 with -100% darkness resistance and 1% cart light radius, I don't care, I don't want to sit through this low tier garbage waiting for things to pop out of the ground so 1 chromatic orb and 20 wisdom scrolls can appear from the loot.

Challenges:
If you thought that incursion rooms for challenges was gated by RNG, then wtf is this league?
There's how many challenges related to rare rooms and bosses?
Where are they?
Do they get more common as you go deeper? Or do I have to shift through an endless amount of trash tier content to find them?

I was bored of my first Delve, I'm bored at my 200th Delve. I don't want do be doing this for months to find these things.

Difficulty:
I don't know where it is. Have you seen it?
This WAS suppose to be a test of your character to see how far you can Delve, but instead its a test of your patience?

The higher tier groups say progression is gated by Sulphite, not difficulty.

I'm all for pushing yourself to your limit before you break and give up. It's fun and gets your heart racing, and if you manage to push somewhere on the ladder it is incredibly fulfilling. Delve isn't this though. Delve is about how many quarries/maps you can be bothered spamming, while the content of Delve being... bad.

Maybe it does get challenging. But the journey to that point of it being challenging is so putrid I wont be doing it. Ever.

How to improve?:
Delve is clearly an attempt at being PoE's Greater Rifts.
That failed.
Ignore the "infinite" and the "ladder" part of Delve and focus more on the rooms and the loot.
Nobody, literally nobody, cares or is going to compete with the current group.

Stack the currency...

Improve and speed up the progression of Delve into higher tiers.

Fix the crashes.

Try greater rifts/infinite scaling again, and don't over complicate it with BS mechnics like EMPs and Darkness and flares and hidden loot.
Make it a real test of character/teamwork.

Summary (tl;dr):
Delve is boring. Delve makes me crash. Delve has a lot of grindy Challenges, and that grind is horrible. Delve isn't Greater Rifts, and it never will be in its current state.

I am really hyped for the race to begin, I won my first alt art Demi last league.
I will be quitting Delve until the race, where in that race I'll most likely be ignoring Delve mechanics.

Just release an endless ledge... Much easier to code and much more fun...

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fesru wrote:

The "encounters" where you click something and some stuff spawns get old very quickly. Especially when they are not challenging... you just find yourself waiting for a handful of skeletons to spawn at a time, then get a terrible reward.
If I liked that stuff, I'd play standard and buy lots of a cowards trial maps.

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fesru wrote:

I would for sure like an endless ledge a lot more. Maybe where you could spend a currency towards buffing the density and add mods to mobs, with some chance encounters and the like.. if you wanna make it more complicated.

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BlazeSTX wrote:

DELVE is meant to be part of STANDARD. that's all.

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bex_HB wrote:

make a character with life gain on hit and whirling blades and all these complaints about "killing darkness" are gone.

i can not hear that any more lol ^^

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Oblitus wrote:

Delve is just a hollow husk of a concept.

Is it accessible? No, unless you have a team to farm sulfite for you or a quarry bot.

Is it fun? No. The endless stupid escort mission, stupid darkness, stupid flares, stupid dynamite, endless azurite chase to keep stupid upgrades.

Is it rewarding? No. Fossils are useless because crafting in PoE is plain broken by insane RNG, all other loot is trash, and even currency nodes are not impressive.

Is it at least challenging? No, my character is able to do T15 maps, but I am stuck at white maps at atlas (map drops are awful) and L110 Delve (goddamn sulfite).

Every league PoE is getting worse and worse, and this time they proved that rock bottom is not a limit.

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postrach_myszy wrote:

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bex_HB wrote:

make a character with life gain on hit and whirling blades and all these complaints about "killing darkness" are gone.

i can not hear that any more lol ^^

I got character just like you described. Cleave Jugg, tanky as hell, 50+k armor without flasks or endurance charges, whirling blades, even phase run under CWDT, with immortal call, not life gain on hit, but good leeching and good speed too (+80% without flasks in "mapping" combination with Abyssus and +100% with lab combination - Devoto's). Regardless, blocking in the darkness still happened for me. No, thanks, besides, I will not go to stupid mines again, so you will not hear that any more at least from me. There is only one good thing with these mines - they can be completely skipped. And that's what I'm going to do, skip all this shitty content. At the same time, I hope that most players will do the same, so GGG will either throw it away or make it playable.

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Kiro_TaintedFate wrote:

I agree except I think game is getting better overall, I mean ascendency reworks, skills reworks, atlas updates, some additional visuals.

But what I think, devs are totally screwed with this league and actually I even think that devs are doing trash leagues since abyss league. Thats why I'm playing PoE (and donating) only during flashback events. They are the reason I'm still here and they are the best what the game can offer.

I didnt like Incursion imo its total trash, temple is not interesting, temporal incursions are speed clear shit, overall map drops in the league were awful. Harbinder was mediocre at best. Besitary was a fail. Delve is stupid because of the reasons you mentioned.

You know what I think? Devs are actually not capable of doing fun leagues anymore. And they desperately afraid of any really revolutionary changes. So we'll get usual 20k steam online players in few weeks. PoE is too stupidly old-fashion game.