[3.15] Broodmother: Summon Spiders Necro | THE NEW OP SUMMONER | 8m DPS | 11k EHP

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OberstGruppenFurer wrote:

Im using flame dash instead of shield charge and its fine. And i dropped enduring cry and put immortal call in CWDT setup.

I didn't want to lose the fortify buff, but maybe more mobility would actually be better for overall survivability. Shield Charge is clunky sometimes.

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Devilator wrote:

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OberstGruppenFurer wrote:

Im using flame dash instead of shield charge and its fine. And i dropped enduring cry and put immortal call in CWDT setup.

I didn't want to lose the fortify buff, but maybe more mobility would actually be better for overall survivability. Shield Charge is clunky sometimes.

For mapping you should use Shield Charge with Fortify, especially during Ultimatum trials, you will die without Fortify. For bosses you can use Dash instead, I did it for my Maven kill last league and it worked fine.

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Inkira wrote:

For mapping you should use Shield Charge with Fortify, especially during Ultimatum trials, you will die without Fortify. For bosses you can use Dash instead, I did it for my Maven kill last league and it worked fine.

I have now cleared a few ultimatums with the build, but half the times I get crowded and die really fast. This is the same in T1 as it is in T10, so it isn't my health or shield pool.

I think what happens is either I get stunned (I had Unwavering Stance in previous build so I am not used to this) or ES runs out so I am instantly out of mana due to MoM, can't move out of the crowd, and I die.

This is an issue when the spiders can't kill things fast enough, so it only happens in ultimatums (haven't tried ritual yet, but breach was fine). I want to try splash support specifically for ultimatums, has anyone tried it?

I have double Renewal now and in T14 maps everything just melts too fast, so Shield Charge (linked Fortify) is still for movement rather than survival! I still only have Temporal Chains and my abyss jewels are all over the place. So it is going very well all in all, just working out the kinks.

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Devilator wrote:

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Inkira wrote:

For mapping you should use Shield Charge with Fortify, especially during Ultimatum trials, you will die without Fortify. For bosses you can use Dash instead, I did it for my Maven kill last league and it worked fine.

I have now cleared a few ultimatums with the build, but half the times I get crowded and die really fast. This is the same in T1 as it is in T10, so it isn't my health or shield pool.

I think what happens is either I get stunned (I had Unwavering Stance in previous build so I am not used to this) or ES runs out so I am instantly out of mana due to MoM, can't move out of the crowd, and I die.

This is an issue when the spiders can't kill things fast enough, so it only happens in ultimatums (haven't tried ritual yet, but breach was fine). I want to try splash support specifically for ultimatums, has anyone tried it?

I have double Renewal now and in T14 maps everything just melts too fast, so Shield Charge (linked Fortify) is still for movement rather than survival! I still only have Temporal Chains and my abyss jewels are all over the place. So it is going very well all in all, just working out the kinks.

Well you definitely need to use Melee Splash for Ultimatums and clearing in general. As for stuns, make sure you have the Soul of the Brine King pantheon power, I have no issues with stuns by using that, and make sure you have a Quartz Flask for the phasing, it helps a lot. Also, do you have Fenumus' Weave body armor? That gives ES regen so even if you are taking heavy damage you will regen enough to escape, as well as reducing the damage of nearby enemies. Last recommendation I have is get a good shield, you want +% block chance on your shield if you can get it. If you link me your build in POB I can take a look and see what can be improved.

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Inkira wrote:

Well you definitely need to use Melee Splash for Ultimatums and clearing in general. As for stuns, make sure you have the Soul of the Brine King pantheon power, I have no issues with stuns by using that, and make sure you have a Quartz Flask for the phasing, it helps a lot. Also, do you have Fenumus' Weave body armor? That gives ES regen so even if you are taking heavy damage you will regen enough to escape, as well as reducing the damage of nearby enemies. Last recommendation I have is get a good shield, you want +% block chance on your shield if you can get it. If you link me your build in POB I can take a look and see what can be improved.

https://pastebin.com/KTJ7heAx

Here it is, I still have to upgrade my amulet and jewels. Dexterity is a little bit of a problem but I will work on it. The more confident I am with the build, the more I am willing to spend on it.

I also like OberstGruppenFurer's variation with two golems.

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Devilator wrote:

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Inkira wrote:

Well you definitely need to use Melee Splash for Ultimatums and clearing in general. As for stuns, make sure you have the Soul of the Brine King pantheon power, I have no issues with stuns by using that, and make sure you have a Quartz Flask for the phasing, it helps a lot. Also, do you have Fenumus' Weave body armor? That gives ES regen so even if you are taking heavy damage you will regen enough to escape, as well as reducing the damage of nearby enemies. Last recommendation I have is get a good shield, you want +% block chance on your shield if you can get it. If you link me your build in POB I can take a look and see what can be improved.

https://pastebin.com/KTJ7heAx

Here it is, I still have to upgrade my amulet and jewels. Dexterity is a little bit of a problem but I will work on it. The more confident I am with the build, the more I am willing to spend on it.

I also like OberstGruppenFurer's variation with two golems.

You need to take or annoint whispers of doom because you missing one curse. And buy this cheap uniq DOT jewel amanamus gaze. You can look at my char in profile. Im using +life on block shield with rumi flask. Felling pretty tanky even in tight ulti encounters.

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OberstGruppenFurer wrote:

You need to take or annoint whispers of doom because you missing one curse. And buy this cheap uniq DOT jewel amanamus gaze. You can look at my char in profile. Im using +life on block shield with rumi flask. Felling pretty tanky even in tight ulti encounters.

Good points there. Map mobs all just die super fast but I guess Amanamu's will help a lot with tough bosses. I am using a basalt flask right now, if I can get some life on block I will switch to Rumi's.

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OberstGruppenFurer wrote:

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Devilator wrote:

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Inkira wrote:

Well you definitely need to use Melee Splash for Ultimatums and clearing in general. As for stuns, make sure you have the Soul of the Brine King pantheon power, I have no issues with stuns by using that, and make sure you have a Quartz Flask for the phasing, it helps a lot. Also, do you have Fenumus' Weave body armor? That gives ES regen so even if you are taking heavy damage you will regen enough to escape, as well as reducing the damage of nearby enemies. Last recommendation I have is get a good shield, you want +% block chance on your shield if you can get it. If you link me your build in POB I can take a look and see what can be improved.

https://pastebin.com/KTJ7heAx

Here it is, I still have to upgrade my amulet and jewels. Dexterity is a little bit of a problem but I will work on it. The more confident I am with the build, the more I am willing to spend on it.

I also like OberstGruppenFurer's variation with two golems.

You need to take or annoint whispers of doom because you missing one curse. And buy this cheap uniq DOT jewel amanamus gaze. You can look at my char in profile. Im using +life on block shield with rumi flask. Felling pretty tanky even in tight ulti encounters.

Yea life on block with Rumi's is something I've been thinking about for this league, will experiment with it before I update the guide tomorrow.

So I went on a shopping spree (around 2.5 ex total) and made some changes. Got more dex than I will ever need and decent everything else. Since I got an unset ring, I did the two golems variation and specced into Golem Commander too. An optimal Large Cluster Jewel will allow me to save three passive points which will go back into life nodes, although that will be a 9% reduction to my total minion damage modifier.

Updated POB: https://pastebin.com/RkFMx9S3

A3 Drox was a little annoying because the spiders were all over the place. Convocation indeed helps direct them a little. This is something common with all minion builds, though this one might be a little more sensitive to it because of the large number of minions and the lack of AoE (when not using melee splash).




================== Shield Charge rant & explanation ========================


I also figured out a big reason why I am "stunned" sometimes: it isn't stuns, it is Shield Charge. That is one really badly designed skill. This is what is happening: if there is an obstacle at any point between your character and where you are clicking, SC will not move your character at all. It will instead lock you in place and perform its melee attack. This also locks you into the attack animation, so any other defensive skill you might try to use will get delayed (Convocation is instant and works, for what it's worth).

This of course is made a thousand times worse by the fact that Shield Charge apparently needs a clear path as wide as the flame animation itself, so it gets blocked by any little terrain detail like a medium size stone, a small chair, or a slight irregularity in the map edges. These are hard enough to notice as you are zooming around the map and impossible to see when fighting a swarm of enemies, or when there are spell effects.

Note that Shield Charge already has a huge dead zone around your character (a little over the length of a Carrion Golem), clicking in which will also not move you.

Flame Dash by comparison has none of these issues. Crucially, if there is an impassable obstacle between you and your destination it moves you up to the obstacle as you would expect, instead of locking you in place like Shield Charge does.

Disabling always attack without moving is a sort of a workaround in some cases (a walkaround, more literally) but there are a lot of other problems with that.

Here is an example of SC being blocked with absolutely nothing in the way, presumably because I am standing just a little close to the terrain:







I wish Leap Slam could be used with daggers. I will try Flame Dash again and see if Fortify saves me more than Shield Charge kills me.

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Devilator wrote:

So I went on a shopping spree (around 2.5 ex total) and made some changes. Got more dex than I will ever need and decent everything else. Since I got an unset ring, I did the two golems variation and specced into Golem Commander too. An optimal Large Cluster Jewel will allow me to save three passive points which will go back into life nodes, although that will be a 9% reduction to my total minion damage modifier.

Updated POB: https://pastebin.com/RkFMx9S3

A3 Drox was a little annoying because the spiders were all over the place. Convocation indeed helps direct them a little. This is something common with all minion builds, though this one might be a little more sensitive to it because of the large number of minions and the lack of AoE (when not using melee splash).

================== Shield Charge rant & explanation ========================

Use predator on bosses, so they will focus target.
That's why im not using shield charge since vaal spark inqusitor in 2014 lol its annoying skill to use.