0.10.4 Patch Notes

^ Very true, Sirian.

I remember clearing with my ranger with faster proj/fork socketed into LA/Split arrows. I encountered loot up to almost 3 screens away, especially from vases/barrels and often mobs. I estimate quality sparks with fork can reach even farther, not to mention what happens when you socket faster projectiles... Same goes for many projectile spells like fireball/ice spear and arrow skills.

Perhaps the time is to allow us to zoom out a slightly more?

"

Chypre wrote:

I always get the ending hit "in parties" when I solo

Unless you are playign automated multi-boxing which is cheating and not allowed by GGG, or you are a mutant with 8 arms and 8 eyes, your complain is a non-starter at all. The game is not intended to be played that way, deal with it.

GGG is not going to balance the game drops and loot system around a handful of cheaters, I hope. The only thing that matters here is 'true solo' vs. 'true party'. No 1 multi-logger (who can't multi log anymore) vs. solo play w/ IIQ gear.

"

Also, what /players 6 would do is simply add monster life and IIQ. You are pulling all of this stuff about monster damage scaling and breaking game balance out of your ass. Monster damage doesn't go up in 6 people teams.

Way to go man, I was not talking about about monster damage, I was talking about PLAYER damage. Do I need to continue? People can one shoot stuff with 1 character in 6-player groups. Add a stupid mechanic like "/player dumb" and it will be a disaster, everyone would have to use it to keep up with inflation. the fact that you can add in top of "/player dumb" IIQ/IIR would only make it even worse; off course you CAN'T get more playing solo w/ IIQ/IIR than multi-boxing (cheating) with IIQ/IIR.

Are you clear GGG does NOT sanction automated multi-boxing and that manual multi-boxing is impossible to be efficient (and safe) unless you are some sort of mutant? Game is working as intended.

---

If you aren't happy with current loot ask for buff in drops, and stop trying to break the game trying to balance it around terrible game styles from everyone else. Not everybody is a multi-logger/multi-boxer or want's the game to be completely broken by adding features like "/player dumb".

The game is almost the same for the majority of the real solo players, stop pretending it screws everybody, nothing has changed for most solo players. Except the '1 screen away stuff' which apparently may affect a subset of builds (sparkers mainly) in certain zones, breaking some furniture and stuff.

"

I don't want to be rude, but Quality 20 spark has +60% projectile speed,
plus projectile speed from items, add to that support gems that allow to fork-pierce,
and let the projectile go further.
i can confirm that on big rooms my sparks reach FAR more than the 13meters. Add to that i cast them through totem, there is even MORE distance.

The example is clearer with fast proj arrows, or fast projectile piercing spears-fireballs.

Yeah in practice projectiles go beyond one screen away (just do the 'widescreen' exploit to check), if it's not intended (which I think it's not) they should fix it. Anyway I think the hassle this will create is minor, is not game breaking as some people are making it to be. In closed spaces rooms rarely are much bigger than one and a half screen, and tight passages/doors, etc. prevent most projectiles going to other rooms. In open spaces the dispersion makes it hard to destroy stuff which is further away.

But well, I think they will end up fixing the projectile distance anyway.

"

knac84 wrote:

Yeah in practice projectiles go beyond one screen away (just do the 'widescreen' exploit to check), if it's not intended (which I think it's not) they should fix it. Anyway I think the hassle this will create is minor, is not game breaking as some people are making it to be. In closed spaces rooms rarely are much bigger than one and a half screen, and tight passages/doors, etc. prevent most projectiles going to other rooms. In open spaces the dispersion makes it hard to destroy stuff which is further away.

But well, I think they will end up fixing the projectile distance anyway.

You probably then miss that SKILLS are different from each other, examples:

Ethereal Knives: low range, high damage, default multi projectiles (ADD faster projectiles to higher the range)

Freezing Pulse: low range, high damage, default piercing (ADD faster projectiles to get higher range)

Spark: low damage, high range, long projectile duration (Add faster projectiles to get higher range)

Fireball: high damage, low piercing "synergy", HIGH range (add faster projectiles for even more range)

So you basically would "balance" skills that have as an advantage the range to put them on par of Low range skills , so we "would have no problems with things killed on distance".

Look, i run spark only for 2 reasons: it saturates rooms and has good range.

that means i can break vases on distance.
Most people look at it with low importance, but since i dropped 2 exalts out of vases,
i am using spark just for this very reason. they can be vases, boulders, cairns.
Everything that you can miss if you don't pay a lot of attention.

Know what? i got only 900 DPS with lvl 19 spark.
Same skills at this level have 10-50k DPS.

I traded off DPS just for area saturation. And this patch has the potential of altering the balance of skills like this (spark is not the only one affected, everything long range is affected)

I just did cruel bandits and got a normal skill point boost instead of a book. Just thought you should know that one isnt set up.

I've been suggesting solo player drop rates get buffed ever since OB started :/

I think the amount of a three person party should be how much drops for a solo player, then only increase by 20% per person up to six people

"

Grimlocke_ wrote:

"

sirianstar wrote:

i submit again as didn't get the answer from any developer:

QUESTIONs to DEVELOPERS:

About recently changes on item drop and Dual/single totem (or far hitting skills):

1)I'm in solo, i use totem with spark to kill far away targets/break vases. Is my item quantity drop
considered as 1 player at 3 screen distance (spark saturates entire rooms and more)
or 0 as i'm too far away?


2)I'm in party of 6 players, i use totem with spark to kill far away targets/break vases (2-3 screen distance). The killed mobs/broken vases are alone, and without any player near,
The drop quantity is for 0, 1 or 6 players (i understand that 6 is excluded)?

3)I'm in a party of 6 players, i use totem with spark to kill far away targets/break vases (2-3 screen distance). Near the mobs there are 5 of my party, but i do the kills:
The drop quantity is for 1, 5 or 6 players?

4) The distance is calculated from the Player or from the Totem?

for 0 i mean: no drop from the mob/broken vase, as no players are near enough, which leads to a x0 quantity multiplier (wasted mob, vase).

This worries me a lot, as well. Since arrows/sparks/many other spells often go off-screen (+ some skill gems extend radius of skills/spells like chain, fork, etc), what happens in that case, both solo and in parties? Will we have to change our builds entirely because of the recent changes?

Its so easy to fix concerns like yours, while still handicapping the multiboxers with the same amount as currently;
Like i suggested many pages back: make the check 2 fold leave the in-range part for people that are actively participating but dont do much damage, and also make people add to loot when they did at least 10% damage on the subject no matter the range (but present on a <connected> map)

"

sirianstar wrote:

You probably then miss that SKILLS are different from each other, examples:

You don't have to convince me of anything, I'm not the developer in charge of skill design or balance.

There are various issues with offscreen shooting widely known since CB, for starters mob AI does not respond to aggression offscreen (that's why widescreen it's an exploit), that trumps any other consideration. This is one of the reasons offscreen shooting is not intentional.


There is a lot of advantages on using spark specially with totems that still are there. Saturation still works, and it always does more efficiently at close range. And while tooltip dps may seem weak, comparing it to close range and even ST target skills is not the way to go. Spark totem builds can be the most devastating in this game, in no way you are sacrificing damage because you can stack insane amounts of crit multiplier w/o fearing reflect (which is the main problem in really endgame, where is were you are going to spend most of your time and should be considered while balancing), coupled with crazy saturation & shocking status ailment you reach insane amounts of damage, way beyond what your tooltip dps says.


But again, I'm not the one making decisions here and do not have to be convinced of anything, neither is this thread the place for that.

"

knac84 wrote:

"

sirianstar wrote:

You probably then miss that SKILLS are different from each other, examples:

RANT

sorry my fault, didn't see it was the same fanboy of 8 pages ago.
Yeah no reason to convince you of anything, would be just wasted time.
damn me that i answered you ;)

Any news on when they will do something about "Arc"? it's really a shame atm, since it's more gear dependent than any other skills in the game and really not good in it's condition in this game.

"

knac84 wrote:

"

Chypre wrote:

I always get the ending hit "in parties" when I solo

Unless you are playign automated multi-boxing which is cheating and not allowed by GGG, or you are a mutant with 8 arms and 8 eyes, your complain is a non-starter at all. The game is not intended to be played that way, deal with it.

GGG is not going to balance the game drops and loot system around a handful of cheaters, I hope. The only thing that matters here is 'true solo' vs. 'true party'. No 1 multi-logger (who can't multi log anymore) vs. solo play w/ IIQ gear.

Have you not even been reading anything I write? Am I multiboxing? I don't have more time for your asinine responses, so I am done with you after this.

I haven't been playing POE that long, but I am going to guess that party loot had worked the way it did for a very long time, if not since the start of the game. I believe GGG said that they are rushing through these loot changes due to all the whining. All I can do is hope that they see the error they made here and fix it.

You go into an area with a bunch of players and the monster have more life, I expect them to drop more loot. If you are going to make that magically stop happening because some people go too far away, make the monsters suddenly have less life, die, drop to 1 HP when damaged or whatever.

"

knac84 wrote:

"

Also, what /players 6 would do is simply add monster life and IIQ. You are pulling all of this stuff about monster damage scaling and breaking game balance out of your ass. Monster damage doesn't go up in 6 people teams.

Way to go man, I was not talking about about monster damage, I was talking about PLAYER damage. Do I need to continue? People can one shoot stuff with 1 character in 6-player groups. Add a stupid mechanic like "/player dumb" and it will be a disaster, everyone would have to use it to keep up with inflation. the fact that you can add in top of "/player dumb" IIQ/IIR would only make it even worse; off course you CAN'T get more playing solo w/ IIQ/IIR than multi-boxing (cheating) with IIQ/IIR.

Are you clear GGG does NOT sanction automated multi-boxing and that manual multi-boxing is impossible to be efficient (and safe) unless you are some sort of mutant? Game is working as intended.

---

If you aren't happy with current loot ask for buff in drops, and stop trying to break the game trying to balance it around terrible game styles from everyone else. Not everybody is a multi-logger/multi-boxer or want's the game to be completely broken by adding features like "/player dumb".

The game is almost the same for the majority of the real solo players, stop pretending it screws everybody, nothing has changed for most solo players. Except the '1 screen away stuff' which apparently may affect a subset of builds (sparkers mainly) in certain zones, breaking some furniture and stuff.

Most players can not go and one shot mobs in any content worth farming which is constantly populated (Merc. Fellshrine). The game shouldn't be balanced around what under 1% of the players with ridiculous damage might be able to do. Nobody was doing this, so you can't use it as a justification for your imagined problems.

You probably just aren't able to kill solo in 6 people games, so you imagine that now that others are cut down to your level, you will be better off.

As I already explained in detail, regular players will be harmed by this patch. Rather than going off in my own in EXP runs, I will hover just close enough to the team that as a high level I will reduce the amount of EXP you are getting since I am in range. I will ninja your drops when possible. I will try to stay as far away as I can, so you can keep whacking at the titans while I collect my 250% IIQ.