Wolcen Hype Release!

You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.

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Xystre wrote:

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Oh, the irony of a Tencent supporter sermonising on cash-grabs.

ANYWAY.

QFT.

They would rather pay $25 for a reskinned HO that took no time to create cuz it was in game already or $35 armors cuz poe rocks, be a good goy and support!

but an entire game for $25? (not sure how much is wolcen sorry) nope.. that will infuriate tggg loyalists.

Uh huh. So you're speaking without even knowing the price of the product you're speaking on? Real valid perspective here. Wolcen is $40, btw. And it was $30. They bumped up the price to encourage pre-sales. That's why people call it a cash grab.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.

You have this strange tendency to be both libertarian and not at the same time. Of course I'm free not to buy. I'm also free to buy, be disappointed and call them out for it. You're free to respond to that. You're also free to not to. So what? What's the point saying "purchase or dont"? The point is they made it such that early purchases were heavily favored (that better?). I could just turn around and say reply or don't. You're free not to, after all. It's your argument that's absurd. Because it isn't an argument at all. It's just intentionally missing the point.

And Wolcen using the same shitty tactics as other games is also hardly a defense. Did I suggest it was unique? I explicitly explained it as another example of a more pervasive problem. And it's not like Wolcen is being singled out or treated differently. No Man's Sky faced plenty of backlash when it messed up, for example (and there's plenty of other examples). If anything, companies being constantly called out for their bullshit is a good thing. It's you who's seemingly expecting Wolcen to be an exception to that rule.

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Oh, the irony of a Tencent supporter sermonising on cash-grabs.

ANYWAY.

Deeply enjoying the tactical possibilities of Evasion. Kind of brilliant of them to make it dash in the opposite direction of the cursor. I've taken down much stronger enemies than I could merely facetank just by learning their attack patterns and using a mix of Evasion and the dodge-roll. Satisfying!

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Xavderion wrote:

Pulling off a cool character name is a big part of the fun of naming characters in PoE. Sense of pride and accomplishment™.

Hardly something at which I need to prove myself more than accomplished. :) I like the idea of making a Musashi, a Thor, a Legolas, and maybe even a Geralt!

Tencent invested into Wolcen Studio a few years ago as part of their Games without Border project.
Enough to pay for almost 40 people and multiple major reworks apparently.

GGG had around 30 people when they officialy released POE back in 2013.

So Wolcen Studio is not the small indie dev you (not you personally) think it is, when comparing studio size and funding.

Wolcen Studio long term plans are similar to POE's ones.
Free expansions and mainly cosmetic MTX to pay for maintenance/expansions or bigger feature patches.
Granted they implement game mechanics to entice people to come back every few months/quarters for constant revenue streams.

The honeymoon phase will be over in less than a month and i hope the initial revenue stream will be enough for their planned (have they any?) short term improvements.

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Exile009 wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

You posted the same thing in the other thread.

1. No one is forced to do anything at all, ever. That's absurd. Purchase or dont. If your patience and judgement is swayed by $10, then I'd say it wasnt worth much to begin with.

2. $30 going to $40 isnt a 50% increase. (Price for many months)

3. Many, many games, incentivize early access, beta keys, cosmetics and collectibles, and all kinds of other shit to get people to come and try, and help fund development.

You have this strange tendency to be both libertarian and not at the same time. Of course I'm free not to buy. I'm also free to buy, be disappointed and call them out for it. You're free to respond to that. You're also free to not to. So what? What's the point saying "purchase or dont"? The point is they made it such that early purchases were heavily favored (that better?). I could just turn around and say reply or don't. You're free not to, after all. It's your argument that's absurd. Because it isn't an argument at all. It's just intentionally missing the point.

And Wolcen using the same shitty tactics as other games is also hardly a defense. Did I suggest it was unique? I explicitly explained it as another example of a more pervasive problem. And it's not like Wolcen is being singled out or treated differently. No Man's Sky faced plenty of backlash when it messed up, for example (and there's plenty of other examples). If anything, companies being constantly called out for their bullshit is a good thing. It's you who's seemingly expecting Wolcen to be an exception to that rule.

Still doesnt address your points at all.

You said people were forced to choose. They were not. They made decisions. If it was worth 30 to them, maybe it would be worth 40. If not then they wait. What exactly is your problem here? People wait for sales, discounts, complete editions, all the time. No one was penalized or forced to do anything. That's a ridiculous conclusion (and it wasnt a 50% increase)

And no one is saying Wolcen shouldn't be reviewed or criticized. Cmon. All I was saying is do it fairly, and accurately.

Is the game a mess with mechanics and online server issues? Yes 100%.

Have the Devs crossed the line with unprecedented shady tactics and predatory behavior? Gimme a break.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but your seemingly presented shock and disgust with Wolcen gets nothing but an eyeroll from me. Idk maybe you are just the review-bomb type. If so, go ahead and live your best life.

I wouldn't worry. Gamers don't forget and don't forgive. If those guys want to do something else down the line there will not be such high sales because burn me once etc.

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Johny_Snow wrote:

I wouldn't worry. Gamers don't forget and don't forgive. If those guys want to do something else down the line there will not be such high sales because burn me once etc.

Lol if only that were true. See EA, Activision, Blizzard, etc..

Gamers 100% do this, and D4 for example, will sell at insane levels.

Hah, like these fools are at the same level to have decades old franchises which were good once and ready to be milked. It is one game, first impression. If it is bad you lose future sales.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

Spoiler

Chris Wilson...is...well something. I love to play armchair psychologist, but I'm on thin fucking ice forum probation wise, so I will pass for now. I will say that he has "evolved" over the last few years.

Money does generally "things" with people,and if you're able to make a lot of it then it does a lot of "special things" with people :)

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

You said people were forced to choose. They were not. They made decisions. If it was worth 30 to them, maybe it would be worth 40. If not then they wait. What exactly is your problem here? People wait for sales, discounts, complete editions, all the time. No one was penalized or forced to do anything. That's a ridiculous conclusion (and it wasnt a 50% increase)

And no one is saying Wolcen shouldn't be reviewed or criticized. Cmon. All I was saying is do it fairly, and accurately.

Is the game a mess with mechanics and online server issues? Yes 100%.

Have the Devs crossed the line with unprecedented shady tactics and predatory behavior? Gimme a break.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but your seemingly presented shock and disgust with Wolcen gets nothing but an eyeroll from me. Idk maybe you are just the review-bomb type. If so, go ahead and live your best life.

Now you're just being disingenuous. They were forced to choose. Calling it 'making decisions' is just being evasive. The choice wasn't between $30 or $40, they already knew that. It was between paying up early for a gamble or being penalized for being sensible. My problem is with gamers being taken for a ride by being encouraged to buy into a broken product before they could know it was broken.

And bringing up other kinds of sales and discounts is just false equivalency - non-launch discounts and sales involve a known quantity i.e. you know what you're buying into, there are already reviews, etc. Here the devs deliberately tried to use the lower price to push an unknown quantity. People were being actively encouraged NOT to wait for the best time (in terms of both price AND quality), but to cash in - the opposite of the phenomenon you're talking about.

And what makes you say the game is being unfairly or inaccurately criticized? The people are pointing out actual bugs, exploits, crashes, etc. etc. And if you're bugged by all the people who're doing nothing but pouring scorn on the game, where were you when this forum was inundated with people doing nothing but singing high praises to it? Some people post balanced reviews, others overly positive and others overly negative. The latter two are opposites, yet you're only taking issue with the negativity, not the hype.

As for me being the 'review-bomb' type, lol. Should I accuse you of being the slavish consumerist type ala your average FIFA gamer? Look at the heading of this thread. It's not about review-bombing, it's about responding to a pervasive malaise that arose on this forum as well. And that malaise is as much with gamers nowadays as with publishers. I've already written that I don't mind Wolcen sorting its own problems out eventually, indeed I wish them luck with that. But I am going to call out threads like this for being part of that malaise that gives us products like this to begin with. Wolcen isn't even the problem here (i.e. on the PoE forums), the existence of pre-release hype threads like this one is.