How dare the reddit PoE mods lock down the 'official' PoE sub-reddit

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AbbadonTheDespoilerator wrote:

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innervation wrote:

The market will dictate whether their price for the api access is fair, not what some armchair user thinks about what things 'should' cost.

Why did all of the large third-party applications announce they are shutting down, if the market price was "fair"?

1. Don't put fair in quotes like I asserted it was fair. That is very dishonest. I'm not going to defend a position I didn't take.

2. Read their manifestos if they didn't post them on reddit, they likely tell you. In the case of Apollo the dev actually contradicted himself. First he said the price was unfair. Then later in his post he said that actually he could have worked at the price point by charging his users more, but he didn't have time to adjust the financial ops of his app b/c reddit didn't give him enough time.

3. This isn't the 'gotchya' question you think it is because you're assuming reddit intended to set a price that 3rd party app developers would pay. 3rd party app devs aren't the only entities accessing their API. This is a bit like asking why Gucci sets their prices where you can't afford them. If you can't afford it, maybe you're not the intended audience.

4. No matter what any 1 person here concludes about the price, including me, we don't get to determine fair market value. The market does. We are all 1 vote in the market.

5. This whole thing is delightfully on topic for PoE because all of this applies to both PoE MtX and in game sales of items.

don't see that it matters, past GGG posting on there sometimes the rest of it is almost entirely pointless (ohh look at my item, spam/memes outrage over next to nothing)
And GGG staff barely even post there now because of the absolute asshattery from players every new league

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innervation wrote:

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Nabster wrote:

I'm very glad this forum exists because otherwise it would be much worse. I don't care that some third party tools that I don't use can't leech money off of reddit anymore, but I do care that 2/3s of my search results are unavailable because people are only talking about it on reddit.

I haven't even heard of these 3d party tools before, and just because mods are power tripping even if I dont like reddit I'm affected. GGG should just fire all reddit their subreddit mods and replace them with their own employees, because they are really just harming their own brand for some app that reddit mods like to use.

On the latter part there is no GGG firing subreddit mods - its not their reddit. But in the first paragraph you are quite right in a way that no one is talking about in all these threads. Reddit owns data and has no obligation to give it away for free to let others make money off of. The market will dictate whether their price for the api access is fair, not what some armchair user thinks about what things 'should' cost.

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vio wrote:

so, you agree that poe should make their apis a paid feature too, killing all free tools like poe.ninja that use them?

Not who you directed the question to, but I would be very ok with that.

Yea I realized after I posted that that it used to be their reddit and then they gave it away. I haven't followed the game again until recently and the way people were talking it seemed as if they were still in control.

So much content being unavailable is still a problem for GGG though. Even if they have official forums, lots of content is currently not accessible and it might happen again because some mod on reddit got mad hes going to be charged for his spell checker bot.
Unfortunately I don't see GGG even with a website revamp making this the primary community for the game, since its all social media centric now.

I hope people either pivot away from "blackout" subs or move away from reddit entirely to platforms that don't have attract this kind of controversy.

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Nubatron wrote:

I think the way things spread is beyond just support. I would argue controversial spreads faster through replies and retweets/shares. Most people might find it vile. Some might find it persuasive still though in a situation where they otherwise wouldn’t have seen it perhaps. Yeah, it takes a special kind of stupid to believe flat earther stuff and it is mostly harmless when they do. I would worry more about harmful beliefs and disinformation on topics like vaccines as an example. Thanks to that special group, we get to have fun with things like polio and measles again.

And even if a lot of people agree with something, that doesn’t make it less vile. Most of the marginalized groups in this world are in the minority and a majority of people think it’s okay to treat some of those groups terribly.

I would like to think that the stupid things get beat up in public, but that doesn’t seem to happen fast enough. [Removed by Support]

Anyway, I’m on my phone so hard to elaborate much. I see part of your point thorough. I just think at the extremes, spreading misinformation and hate should just be pulled out at the root.

I would be much more on board with this line of thinking if the pulling out at the root worked.

[Removed by Support]

On a side note, Reddit seems to be willing to make compromises... so let's see if the subreddit mods are also willing to compromise:
https://mods.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/16693988535309

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Xyel wrote:

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Nubatron wrote:

I think the way things spread is beyond just support. I would argue controversial spreads faster through replies and retweets/shares. Most people might find it vile. Some might find it persuasive still though in a situation where they otherwise wouldn’t have seen it perhaps. Yeah, it takes a special kind of stupid to believe flat earther stuff and it is mostly harmless when they do. I would worry more about harmful beliefs and disinformation on topics like vaccines as an example. Thanks to that special group, we get to have fun with things like polio and measles again.

And even if a lot of people agree with something, that doesn’t make it less vile. Most of the marginalized groups in this world are in the minority and a majority of people think it’s okay to treat some of those groups terribly.

I would like to think that the stupid things get beat up in public, but that doesn’t seem to happen fast enough. [Removed by Support]

Anyway, I’m on my phone so hard to elaborate much. I see part of your point thorough. I just think at the extremes, spreading misinformation and hate should just be pulled out at the root.

I would be much more on board with this line of thinking if the pulling out at the root worked.

[Removed by Support]

On a side note, Reddit seems to be willing to make compromises... so let's see if the subreddit mods are also willing to compromise:
https://mods.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/16693988535309

[Removed by Support] That's good news on the moderator tools though. I don't know if I care about the third-party apps like Apollo or RIF. But the free work they get from moderators shouldn't be part of the collateral damage by way of making their jobs drastically harder.

Hopefully that is a lingering sentiment, and not just something they offer temporarily to calm the storm and claw back slowly, so people don't notice an abrupt change.

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lagwin1980 wrote:

don't see that it matters, past GGG posting on there sometimes the rest of it is almost entirely pointless (ohh look at my item, spam/memes outrage over next to nothing)
And GGG staff barely even post there now because of the absolute asshattery from players every new league

See I don't keep up with this shit at all but I know you're OG enough to remember when the PoE sub was basically GGG's de facto chat room so what exactly happened? Where did the love go? Why would gamer redditors turn on devs willing to actually engage with them on a subreddit? Don't they know what a fucking gift that was?

And where do GGG interact with the community now? Coz it sure as shit has never been here, not after Beta anyway.