Arc

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Sa_Re wrote:

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LogoOnPoE wrote:

Other spells are better against 1-2 targets and against huge mobs

I don't think you realize how powerful Arc is now with good builds and items.

Nice buff but 60% more dam was a pretty lazy way.

//By the way, it seems that it is only chains 5 times at level 20, for a total of 6 hits. This means for a 3 mob group every mob gets hit a guaranteed number of two times.

The lack of support is what makes Arc poor at scaling. Without other spells having the strong supports that Arc can not get, Arc will probably be better now than the other spells even in the worse cases (single mob, very many mobs), while it will be amazing in its niche (3 mobs, with trail-off as numbers grow up to 6). This is because it was balanced previously as being about the same as other spells in terms of damage without taking into account the supports, and now it has been buffed.*

However, once you add in the strong supports, shotgun spells are going to be way better against bosses and two mobs. For three mobs, Arc will likely be quite good still, however, for a greater number of mobs Arc steadily loses out.

Basically, they have increased the base function of Arc (more damage, more chains), but the scaling function is still broke (lack of strong supports). However, for the majority of players (those who don't get past the first level of maps) the difference in scaling power between Arc and other spells may not be noticeable.

*In reality, not having the strong supports likely means having a low level of Arc, where the level scales the number of chains. So, Arc actually wont be much buffed by this point.

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vargorn wrote:

Just killed the Weaver in Merciless Standard on my lvl 62 Lightning Witch using [Arc + Lightning Penetration + Faster Casting + Crit-Dmg] with Bloodrage, Critical Weakness and a simple Skeleton Totem. The fight was not easy, but well managable with good positioning - compared to being almost impossible prebuff with the same setup.

This is interesting. If weaver fights pre-map are quite doable then that may mean the interception issue is not so important to fix/change anymore; we'll have to see how others fare here though, first.

Are there any map-weaver fights (or, of a similar vein)? I am assuming these might still be near impossible if so, and therefore the interception issue would still exist - however, I could be wrong. Technically, most maps are done in groups anyway, so the issue may not be noticeable even if it does exist for maps.

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Odoakar wrote:

Quite a nice change, loving the new build.

Using Life leech/Iron will - Arc - Light pen - Ele. prolif - Chain, having a bit of sustain problems but that should be solved in a few lvls.

Will get me going until light ball is out. Or maybe I'll stick with arc in the end.

Arc mtx please.

Take out the Chain support - it doubles the mana cost and only does 2/3 of the overall damage:

Lets assume 100 damage per hit of Arc, before Chain.

Arc, 6 hits total; 6*100 = 600 damage.
Chain-supported Arc, 8 hits total, 50% damage; 8*100*0.5 = 400 damage.


Use added chaos damage (helps counter ele reflect/resistant mobs), or something instead of Chain.

Knocked around with it. Feels like a pretty good workhorse when its leveled up and has some chain to it - fights the desync monster, good on small average groups, good for Storm Call cleanup, and the only lightning spell that works with Life Leech at range. It even shocks more often (in non-crit form) than Storm Call due to hitting twice.

M-maybe a little too much overall? I don't even know anymore.

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Aimeryan wrote:

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Odoakar wrote:

Quite a nice change, loving the new build.

Using Life leech/Iron will - Arc - Light pen - Ele. prolif - Chain, having a bit of sustain problems but that should be solved in a few lvls.

Will get me going until light ball is out. Or maybe I'll stick with arc in the end.

Arc mtx please.

Take out the Chain support - it doubles the mana cost and only does 2/3 of the overall damage:

Lets assume 100 damage per hit of Arc, before Chain.

Arc, 6 hits total; 6*100 = 600 damage.
Chain-supported Arc, 8 hits total, 50% damage; 8*100*0.5 = 400 damage.


Use added chaos damage (helps counter ele reflect/resistant mobs), or something instead of Chain.

Yeah, that's true. I only have it at three chains at the moment, so I do lose a bit of dps, but gain a lot of safety in invasion, as I can spam the mobs off screen. Later on, I'll probably swap it with add light or add chaos.

Damage Effectiveness no longer applies to base damage of spells. It does apply to Added Chaos and Added Lightning though, making those supports subpar.

Empower is the way to go for Arc because it increases the base damage.

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DeviantLightning wrote:

Damage Effectiveness no longer applies to base damage of spells. It does apply to Added Chaos and Added Lightning though, making those supports subpar.

Empower is the way to go for Arc because it increases the base damage.

Arguable now. 6 hits at 50% damage effectiveness means 300% effectiveness of those supports; that is not too bad. It is true that aoe spells get better support out of the 'added x' supports (more targets hit, greater base damage effectiveness), but Arc is not as shafted as it was.

arc is good for mobs.
but what lightning skill to use for single mob? like boss?

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nevidonas wrote:

arc is good for mobs.
but what lightning skill to use for single mob? like boss?

Arc before supports it will be about equal to Storm Call against a single target (if you get all the Storm Calls to hit), but the mana cost of Storm Call is better. Throwing in supports (especially a 6-linked Arc vs a 4-linked Storm Call), Arc will be better, but even more mana intensive (which is an issue because bosses are usually the single-target and thus require sustainability + no extra mobs to mana leech from).

Spark can shotgun, and take LMP/GMP; this is your winner. That said, 4-link vs 6-link... would have to look at it more carefully, but I still think Spark will come out ahead.

Looking at the Arc levels and what levels you get extra chains at, lvl 20 gives 5 chains (6 total hits), lvl 21 gives 6 chains (7 total hits) - it would be very advisable I feel to get Arc to at least level 21 one way or another (+1 to lightning/all gems or empower).

Lvl 26 Arc gives 7 chains (8 total hits), which is reachable with an empower and +1 to all gems and +2 to lightning gems:

20 + 2 (lightning) + 1 (all) + 3 (lvl 4 empower) = 26.

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Aimeryan wrote:

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nevidonas wrote:

arc is good for mobs.
but what lightning skill to use for single mob? like boss?

Arc before supports it will be about equal to Storm Call against a single target (if you get all the Storm Calls to hit), but the mana cost of Storm Call is better. Throwing in supports (especially a 6-linked Arc vs a 4-linked Storm Call), Arc will be better, but even more mana intensive (which is an issue because bosses are usually the single-target and thus require sustainability + no extra mobs to mana leech from).

Spark can shotgun, and take LMP/GMP; this is your winner. That said, 4-link vs 6-link... would have to look at it more carefully, but I still think Spark will come out ahead.

i dont like arc at all.