(3.2) [Lighty] 2H RT Cyclone: Dope for Beast League & Lab™

New player here.

I'm wondering what variant of the builds you listed to go. What are the most notable differences between them?

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Zarnakk wrote:

New player here.

I'm wondering what variant of the builds you listed to go. What are the most notable differences between them?

The only variables are what weapon (mace, axe, sword) or ascendancy. Aside from that its all generic 2hd RT melee cyclone.

What exactly are you asking ? What ascendancy to go? They all work, it just depends on your play style.

is this built viable for standard ? what're the pro's and cons ?

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Samir316 wrote:

Hi Archimitrios

Just to clarify, all I meant was that Maim was better used by a totem then as a support to your main cyclone because of this line :

"Enemies maimed by Supported Skills take 20% increased physical damage". It means that your enemy can be maimed by anything, not necessarily you.

So if you are a physical-focused build such as Cyclone with a Starforge, its good to put Maim as a support to Warchief or Protector for bosses. We'll have to see the mechanics but I think if you have vulnerability on the same mob, it will stack with Vuln's increased phys taken.

(http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Damage_taken)


As for chance to bleed, it currently has flat physical values comparable to abyssus in the beta at level 20. It might be OK but probably would be better on a 1h setup since 2h weapons already have a high flat value and benefit more from attack speed. I could see it being OK on a low phys base such as Terminus Est, but outclassed on stuff like Disfavour and Starforge. I think its current flat phys value will be nerfed though, so I'll reserve judgment here.

And yes, I dont think bleed is a great source of damage in a phys clone build anyway because of the fact that it doesnt stack, even with both vuln and maim, and the fact that it is at its best when you move the enemy. I prefer using bleed with Lacerate + Lions Roar.

Yes, I agree that Maim works better in a Totem, which is why I said it.

I was correcting your statement:

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Maim, I think will be better utilized on a Warchief because of how bleed works. Bleed is a single physical degen stack, based on the largest hit a mob recently took. Cyclone hits 5+ times a second even on a slow 2 hand setup, it only refereshes the bleed. If you put it on a warchief, you will get the extra damage debuff on mobs and you can use a gem slot that front loads you damage a little better. I would rather use Melee Damage on Full Life if I am running cyclone off mana, or faster attacks or added fire if I am running it off blood magic.

Not that you said Maim would be better on a Totem, which I agree with, but because you said Maim is better on a Totem because of how bleed works. While your assessment of how Bleed works is correct, it's irrelevant to Maim being better on a Totem than Cyclone. Whether or not you even inflict Bleed, Maim is hands down better on a Totem.

Hello, i'm new to the game and...

I'm currently with this equipments, my dps with cyclone is like 11k-15k.

I'm on the right way? What can I do now? Maybe change the gem/links? for what?

Upgrade equipments or just leveling? Where? Maps?

Clean my mind, please!!!

Thanks for the build/topic.

Keep it up with the good work.

Great guide,

I am currently messing around on 3.0, what are your thoughts on going full physical with a debuff totem?

cyc-brut-bloodlust-meleephys-fortity-conc and using warchief totem to bleed/maim.

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Gorwarth wrote:

Great guide,

I am currently messing around on 3.0, what are your thoughts on going full physical with a debuff totem?

cyc-brut-bloodlust-meleephys-fortity-conc and using warchief totem to bleed/maim.

Its definitely looking viable at this point, and has natural synergies with starforge. Stacking shock chance instead of elemental damage. You can run gruthkul's pelt or kaoms heart and go blood magic as well. The downside is that with brutality you will lose a lot of value out of flasks because good ones like taste of hate and sins rebirth scale non-physical, and Lions Roar is annoying to use with cyclone. And you lose Herald of Ash whch is a tremendous clear speed boost.

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Gorwarth wrote:

Great guide,

I am currently messing around on 3.0, what are your thoughts on going full physical with a debuff totem?

cyc-brut-bloodlust-meleephys-fortity-conc and using warchief totem to bleed/maim.

Unless I am mistaken (highly likely) HOA still works with Brutality since its not linked to the skill gem?

Ditto hatred.

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Gorwarth wrote:

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Gorwarth wrote:

Great guide,

I am currently messing around on 3.0, what are your thoughts on going full physical with a debuff totem?

cyc-brut-bloodlust-meleephys-fortity-conc and using warchief totem to bleed/maim.

Unless I am mistaken (highly likely) HOA still works with Brutality since its not linked to the skill gem?

Ditto hatred.

Pretty sure to do the damage you will need to hit with the skill and thus hatred even if unlinked will do 0 elemental damage with cyclone if cyclone is supported by brutality.

HoA will probably lose its X% fire damage boost on the skill...I'll hop on the beta and test it out this week and report back if the overkill part still works though.

Edit: HoA overkill works but loses its %physical as fire. Hatred does nothing with brutality. So brutality cyclone commits you to 100% phys.

If you're running Brutality, you'll most likely want to use Blasphemy-Vulnerability and Haste (or possibly a defensive aura), which will allow you to run Cyclone off the 15% remaining unreserved mana.

I've been playing with this setup on builder and in the beta, and it's fairly competitive in terms of damage, but suffers a few flaws.
Note: All of this is assuming you're not using Starforge. Obviously with Starforge, Brutality is the clear winner.

1. Cursing Vulnerability means no Warlord's Mark, so you'll need to get Endurance Charges elsewhere. Easiest way to do this is using the Juggernaut Ascendancy, which lacks in damage without really good gear investment. Alternately, there's Warcry, which is just plain annoying to use, or double curse, which is a pain to fit into the build.

2. Full phys makes resistant mobs a chore, and reflect extremely deadly. Even with Slayer's 50% less phys reflect, it's pretty rough when you're not spreading your damage out among multiple sources.

3. The build is fairly competitive DPS wise with the typical HoA/Hatred... but only just. It really doesn't bring any inherent advantage to the table, and comes with its own host of challenges to deal with. That said;

3a. I have noticed a slight bump in single target damage, which I attribute to Maim (via Totem) granting a higher damage increase to full phys than converted damage, but it hasn't felt large enough to make a notable difference.

3b. To really boost kill speed, you can run Bloodlust with Chance to Bleed Warchief. Unfortunately this means you either need to drop your totem for every pack, or suffer significantly reduced damage without it, but it does make for pretty good boss damage.

3c. Ruthless is actually really strong, due to Cyclone's high attack speed, but whatever the planned changes to make it more "predictable" are could very well change that.

3d. All of that aside, the inability to use Atziri's Promise/Taste of Hate really cripples any DPS advantage the build might have.



If you do want to run full Phys, the prime build will probably be:
Cyclone-Brutality-MeleePhys-*FasterAttacks-Ruthless/Bloodlust/Fortify-Conc/IncAoE
Warchief-*Maim-CtBleed(Bloodlust)
Blasphemy-Vuln Haste
*Note: Maim's innate bonus is actually stronger than Faster Attacks, so that's an option, though many players prefer higher attack speeds with Cyclone, and it's still weaker than Ruthless/Bloodlust/Conc.

Ascendancy will probably be Juggernaut, without another reliable/noninvasive way of generating Endurance Charges (Slayer/Berserker/Champion + Warcry).

TLDR:
Without Starforge, the Brutality build is competitive in terms of damage, but offers no tangible advantage over the traditional Elemental (HoA/Hatred) build to make up for the greater number of issues.

With Starforge, the build Brutality build is a monster, albeit fairly exclusive in terms of build choices.