AI can generate portaits indistinguishable from real human faces. what does this mean?
" Hi, you just described the human brain. GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
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" Ah, you beat me to it. :D Granted, we still have a ways to go, but I think most people don't realize just how likely it is to happen in their lifetime. They still think it's the stuff of science fiction and nothing more. I don't blame them either. Someone who hasn't heard of, for example, the Fermi Paradox or the SETI efforts (i.e. serious people doing serious thinking about the subject) is very likely to shrug off the 'aliens' topic as crazy talk. The AI topic is similar in that regard. When you say "extra-terrestrials", people think "photoshopped hoax UFO pictures". When you say "true AI", they think "Skynet". :) ____________________________________________________________________________________
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" That sounds fair. I think "decision" is broad and encompasses some pretty active decision-making. Possibly the difference comes down to what is driving the software, in terms of needs. What will True AI need? " The likelihood of Earth being habitable fore them might be smaller. SETI amuses me greatly. Hopefully the aliens are so advanced and disease free they sort out our chimpanzee ways in short order and raise our consciousness. It's great, SETI. If we get wiped out, maybe we deserve that, and if not, win. Of course it could be just a low-key visitation, along the lines of when they came to visit Ezekial and help with some architecture. What do you guys think it might be like? Off topic chat
Spoiler
Ah, replying properly seems to have had the moment pass on that tangent, Nemo.
The melting pot definitely wasn't a dig. I've not talked with someone from Istanbul before :) I don't know what the Blizzard forums are like first hand. By the sounds of it, they are aggressively modded and haven't got a quiet backwater like this one. Pity, but maybe that makes this one even more chill. Does it snow there, or too close to the sea? | |
" Personally, I'm more curious about the eventual fate of this little thing before actual 'face-to-face' contact even becomes an issue. Then again, an inhabited planet may be a bit more noticeable in the vast vacuum of space than an itty bitty metal box with a radio dish and a golden disc on it, so who knows? :) I'll hopefully come back to the AI topic once I've given it some more thought.
Off-topic chat
" No worries, got all I needed from your 'rushed' response. :) It's amazing how quickly and shortly we can get the most important things we want to say across, when we have to. Probably why things like Twitter (and before that, SMS) became as popular as they have. It feels bittersweet, observing Twitter in that light. Watching people be more 'direct' with each other, but losing out on a lot of the 'nuance' at the same time. Whenever I see one of those multi-tweet posts I feel strangely 'content', thinking: "Oh good, that's still a thing. That's still an option if necessary." Ah, I'm ranting on again, but that's why I love the spoiler tag. ^^ " Funny you should ask, because for the first (second?) time this year, it did snow, just today. Apparently. While I was asleep. Wasn't the knee-high "let's make a snowman" weather we were expecting though. One of the stereotypical points of pride of our country is being able to fully enjoy all four seasons. In a lot of ways, Istanbul is like a smaller scale model of Turkey, and climate is no exception. But it's also notorious for confusing the shit out of meteorologists. At this point, I'm convinced that it's deliberately making fun of them. It's quite entertaining to watch unfold whenever it happens. :) ____________________________________________________________________________________
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" That's an interesting message in a bottle. No idea it existed until now. This gave me a smile " Be funny if the whales were singing ancestral songs about humans. Can't say we'd fare too well there. But it's an interesting project, literally. I wonder if it'll be intercepted and studied.
Off-topic chat
" Yes, it's funny isn't it? It was late and I had hit the tired wall. Glad the essence came across. I think that extra nuance and especially multi tweets can also be read as being passionate, worked up, or insistent on saying something all of which are reassuringly human. Composed short tweets are quite studied, or seem that way. You're not ranting. Maybe you've been on twitter and in brief mediums for a long time?! Yeh, public forums are a funny medium. I like to think they are a lot like work emails especially to more than one person - most of it doesn't get read, or at most, skimmed. Most threads it's the first and last posts that are read by most people. Off topic's a bit different, of course, as it's such a backwater. " That is funny. Enjoy the brief beauty of it, and I hope you get to see some falling. That is so peaceful, falling snow. I didn't know that about Turkey, or Istanbul in particular. Funnily enough, Melbourne is notorious for "four seasons in one day". Yesterday it was 43 c and blazing blue sky at 2 pm, and at 4 pm was 22, clouded over, and a howling gale. It rained overnight and now it's a cool 18. Typical summer change, and we do have seasons and it's somewhat predictable, but even then it can go from blue shy to hail, fog, howling winds throughout the year. Winter can be freezing (drop under 0 overnight) and then sunny and mild. Having lived in the Tropics (Far North) where it's either Dry season or Wet, and fairly constant weather aside from rain and cyclones, Melbourne is bizarre. So I get weather variability. The latitudes -- 37° San Francisco, USA Athens, Greece Seoul, South Korea Granada, Spain Malaga, Spain Seville, Spain Mykonos, Greece Faro, Portugal Antalya, Turkey Melbourne, Australia Looks like Melbourne got a big Southern Ocean influence there, because while we have some of the Northen Hemi balminess, and blazing heat in Summer, we have a lot of days that that aren't! Istanbul sits at 41 degrees, on par with Bariloche, Argentina Last edited by erdelyii on Jan 4, 2019, 7:49:47 PM
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" you can't know it, a software has no problems with finding out whats true and whats false there. this software is nowhere near perfect and quite easily to disprove. It can only trick humans, not pixel scans etc. evidence in crime and human psyche must move forward. there was already something like in our history. Back when we suddenly understood that people can lie and we need actual evidence. and well, same with deepfakes, thats just childish application of things we know since the 80's. try again when there is actual progress in the base theory. until then we will still have inefficient systems the we now allow to not be exact in computions as long as the scope is above 90% accuracy. and suddenly everthing is new and shiny? nope sorry. Current Build: Penance Brand
God build?! https://pobb.in/bO32dZtLjji5 |
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" Don't even joke about it. I hope we get a chance to explain ourselves before they initiate P.O.S. (Planet Obliteration Sequence), leaving the guy who came up with that acronym on the surface. "Look, we were young and stupid back then..." *whale screams in background* "I TOLD YOU TO DO IT QUIETLY!.. Er, I mean... We have ice cream and pizza!" - EARTH SAVED -
Off-topic chat
" For now, I'm mostly just observing them. With a wary and perhaps overly analytical eye. It's fun, watching human communication evolve. Even if you don't participate in every form of it. " Ocean, you scary. That beach advertisement / pamphlet thing you posted before... If it's located in Melbourne, it should have just said: "Every day is a new adventure!" Man, I should be in advertising. ____________________________________________________________________________________
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" Lemme tell you how GANs (the "software" which make this possible) work. There's a Generator who at first more or less randomly generates images. Then there's a (pre-trained) Discriminator who checks if the image made by the Generator resembles the original (target) image. Then, the Discriminator tells the Generator how much of an error it made, and the Generator incorporates this feedback into its next image; it becomes better. The goal of the Generator is to trick the Discriminator into believing that the image it created is the original image. The goal of the Discriminator is to become better at detecting fakes from the Generator, which in turn makes the Generator even better because he has to try harder to trick the Discriminator. This means that by design, the software does have problems with finding out whats true and whats false, once it's sophisticated enough at least. It's the entire point of the setup. " GANs have only existed for 4 years now. GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
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" Thanks, but i read it myself. By design this system only checks it against himself. The discriminator is not almighty and as with all programms that use a for of NNs behind it is actually vulnerable to bias. Especially if there is no target(you know, when you make a fake) What i talk about is actual pixel computing, a far lower level. Also the poster above talked about faking others, not making realistic faces(which is the primary use of the software, and yes, it is a software no need for quoting marks). Making something new that people can't discrimitate as fake is completly different to take something exisiting and fake it. Also it can only do portraits and it seems only with closed mouths. Still in its babyshoes :> " Yeah, GANs is software, meaning an application. The mathematical algrothims and logical gating structure as well as the fundamentals (the actual meat behind a written software and all that shiny NN stuff) exist since forever. We knew about it in the 40's. primitive structures were implemented in the 50's. What we use now has the mathematical foundations somewhere from the 80's. The only difference from then to now is, that we actually have the capacity to build this in a useable size. And we increased the error margins for computing time: most discriminators are ok with about 95% last a read through some papers. Software in actual production environments have an even lower thresholds, because time is money here :) Current Build: Penance Brand
God build?! https://pobb.in/bO32dZtLjji5 |
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^AI is pretty funny nowadays.
I was watching this talk about it probably a year ago already and it's hilarious how biased the programs are and how easily they are fooled into mistakes compared to the human brain. This one program was asked to identify an animal and it bassicaly told "wolf" everytime because the dog in the picture was surounded by snow and pine tree's.(which due to it's database was associated with wolf in the context) That bassicaly displays the danger of AI programs without conditions to verify actions with humans. They can make the most obvious mistakes due to corelation error's in their data-base and given the opportunity to act on those would be disastrous. On the other hand, humans are prone to push the red button in front of them rather then not so it will be interesting where all of this research and practical aplication leads to. Peace, -Boem- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes
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