Why dedicate my time if I can lose all my XP with a death penalty?

"

ogmersault#4806 wrote:

Strong disagree here. We are not here to provide business advice. The forum is early access feedback, not early access business model help. We give feedback, and play the game, or dont. EVERYTHING ELSE YOU DESCRIBED HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. its up to them what they think will help them in the long run, not us. These are not our decisions to make. How many people you think theyll lose, who invests in their company, who their lead designer is, whether or not they have a coffee shop in their office, or get blowies at break time. None of that matters here, in this forum. Give them feedback on your early access experience. Discourse within the community is healthy as long as its on topic and in good faith.

You didn't understand a single word I said, and on top of that you felt single targeted by everything I said. The latter is my bad because I used "you" all over after quoting you, but it was just only general thinking of a general "you" including even me. I was just quoting you to follow up on your topics.

Something I'd like to mention is that I'm not against the exp penalty remaining in the game if certain hazards are more visible to players.

If I die to something, I need to know what it was, or how am I supposed to avoid it and learn from it? There needs to be a death log. What just one shot me - did I miss one of those dinky little purple orbs of crap? Stand in a patch of something I couldn't see for too long or miss some on-death effect as my firewalls were obscuring them? Or did I die to a nasty attack from a mob I need to prioritise next time?

I got to T15 maps with my Infernalist witch and started getting wrecked. Fair enough, I'm grinding out lower levels which I did quite comfortably, obviously my gear is not quite there yet. But I would like to know, when I do die, what damage caused it, or the only way I can improve is to seek more energy shield and hope next time I have enough to absorb the hit.

Sometimes I don't even know I'm fighting a rare until my minions take longer than usual to kill it. I really think some of the telegraphing could use being more obvious if failing means losing exp.

"

Vinsdvalh#0247 wrote:

"

ogmersault#4806 wrote:

Strong disagree here. We are not here to provide business advice. The forum is early access feedback, not early access business model help. We give feedback, and play the game, or dont. EVERYTHING ELSE YOU DESCRIBED HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. its up to them what they think will help them in the long run, not us. These are not our decisions to make. How many people you think theyll lose, who invests in their company, who their lead designer is, whether or not they have a coffee shop in their office, or get blowies at break time. None of that matters here, in this forum. Give them feedback on your early access experience. Discourse within the community is healthy as long as its on topic and in good faith.

You didn't understand a single word I said, and on top of that you felt single targeted by everything I said. The latter is my bad because I used "you" all over after quoting you, but it was just only general thinking of a general "you" including even me. I was just quoting you to follow up on your topics.

I understood your point. Looking at it through the lens of a business customer relationship in order to try and avoid complacency. What I’m saying is no, look at it through the lens of a PLAYER, and provide feedback on the GAME. There is absolutely no need to view this through the scope of business as a player. The business side of things is up to GGG. Whether they fail or not is independent of us as players. That’s entirely on them. You can want them to not fail, or want them to, but it holds zero weight on providing feedback to the gameplay.

"

ogmersault#4806 wrote:

I understood your point. Looking at it through the lens of a business customer relationship in order to try and avoid complacency.

Fair enough, you did understand, another my bad for this one.

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ogmersault#4806 wrote:

What I’m saying is no, look at it through the lens of a PLAYER, and provide feedback on the GAME. There is absolutely no need to view this through the scope of business as a player. The business side of things is up to GGG. Whether they fail or not is independent of us as players. That’s entirely on them. You can want them to not fail, or want them to, but it holds zero weight on providing feedback to the gameplay.

That's what everybody is doing, but in a traditional business you don't have open interference from other clients during the feedback process. You say that "Discourse within the community is healthy as long as its on topic and in good faith." and it's very right but it never happens like that. Every review that calls for a change of design is turning into a lavish debate of personal interests, as if GGG was reading and counting points. I think this constant result in the feedback process is doing more harm than good. And instead of having a clear sound of "everybody likes this" or "everybody hates that", it's just noise ...

since Jan 2nd on SteamDB player count is almost 100k down!
Aaaaaaaaaaand this is the effect of a wasting time endgame has on this game. Hope in a month it will go down to PoE1 lvls - dozens of try hards.
It is funny how I went from checking when the stash tabs are on sale to buy and support PoE2 to straight quit after not even 2 hours of endgame.
Fix that that endgame and ppl might stay a wee longer and god forbid enjoy the endgame.
FIX?.. No 1 portal per map which results in removal of XP loss and item loss.
How about this? - reduce the XP gained by 1% per death on a map (if this is something that gets die hard ppl off so much) - but do not kick out and do not lose items - big big big big big waste of time.
Thanks!

"

Sogardev#9713 wrote:

since Jan 2nd on SteamDB player count is almost 100k down!
Aaaaaaaaaaand this is the effect of a wasting time endgame has on this game. Hope in a month it will go down to PoE1 lvls - dozens of try hards.
It is funny how I went from checking when the stash tabs are on sale to buy and support PoE2 to straight quit after not even 2 hours of endgame.
Fix that that endgame and ppl might stay a wee longer and god forbid enjoy the endgame.
FIX?.. No 1 portal per map which results in removal of XP loss and item loss.
How about this? - reduce the XP gained by 1% per death on a map (if this is something that gets die hard ppl off so much) - but do not kick out and do not lose items - big big big big big waste of time.
Thanks!

😆 🤣 😂 😹

Thanks for the laughs.
You are amazing
Stay golden

"

Wormabutter#4288 wrote:

"

Sogardev#9713 wrote:

since Jan 2nd on SteamDB player count is almost 100k down!
Aaaaaaaaaaand this is the effect of a wasting time endgame has on this game. Hope in a month it will go down to PoE1 lvls - dozens of try hards.
It is funny how I went from checking when the stash tabs are on sale to buy and support PoE2 to straight quit after not even 2 hours of endgame.
Fix that that endgame and ppl might stay a wee longer and god forbid enjoy the endgame.
FIX?.. No 1 portal per map which results in removal of XP loss and item loss.
How about this? - reduce the XP gained by 1% per death on a map (if this is something that gets die hard ppl off so much) - but do not kick out and do not lose items - big big big big big waste of time.
Thanks!

😆 🤣 😂 😹

Thanks for the laughs.
You are amazing
Stay golden

That is why I am here for !

"

dwqrf#0717 wrote:

Yeah right. So having the right value of defense to not get one shoted, tank a big hit, use a pot and reposition, and thus, survive : that's bad for the game because you should have died, or else it's killing the challenge of the game ????

You say going 10-20 maps without dying is a problem for the game. Is that a joke ? Again, do you have any clue what hardcore players are doing in arpg or do you have to keep comparing it to some completely self-made challenges in games not designed to do so ?

If you are one of the top players, then great you can clear all sorts of content that would kill the normies. I'm not talking about them.

Yes, if most players can go ten to twenty maps without dying it means the game is not challenging. It should take a lot more than defense and being able to tank a bit hit: the bosses should have mechanics that keep players on the edge. We have dodge rolls and movement skills that should need to be used to avoid them. A great character with great gear and a great build should still die if the player doesn't execute all those mechanics well.

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ogmersault#4806 wrote:

I disagree. If you put in the time to make a build with gear strong enough to trivialize the difficulty then you absolutely should be able to. No one is arguing that the game is perfectly balanced. its about a penalty that happens if you die. You SHOULD be trying to break the game. If the average player is capable of doing this, then they deserve to be able to. GGG has a way of finding a counter to your meta, and they have been doing this in some pretty cool(and not so cool) ways for a long time.

If the average player is capable of breaking the game, then that needs to be rebalanced. If you can trivialize the difficulty then there is no accomplishment. You can't say getting to level 100 should be a special feat if you can just skate your way there.

The game should be about the challenge you face before you die, not the penalty that happens after. One makes the game engaging, the other makes it tedious.

"

Mouser#2899 wrote:

"

ogmersault#4806 wrote:

I disagree. If you put in the time to make a build with gear strong enough to trivialize the difficulty then you absolutely should be able to.

If the average player is capable of breaking the game, then that needs to be rebalanced. If you can trivialize the difficulty then there is no accomplishment.

Ho, I'm feeling quite accomplished to level up a character, to make my own build, to gear him up myself from drops and crafts, and to grind and farm enough to trivialize the content. It's a great feeling ! If I can reach level 100 doing so, I'll be ever more happy of myself. And you can't ever deny that from me.