Why dedicate my time if I can lose all my XP with a death penalty?

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BK2710#6123 wrote:
The entire debacle can be solved by moving the punishment to a reward instead. Reward deathless completion chains with stacking xp/item bonuses and maybe a currency for it so the "really good" players can get some unique items someone who dies every now and then cannot.

Bad feeling converted to a rewarding feeling, everyone wins.

Alternatively, opt-in features via toggles or a league akin to SSF on char creation. No side has to give up anything and everyone stands to gain from it. The only losers are those with malicious intend/vested interest in botting/RMT/selling services which is a problem to begin with.

There are a few people who barely make it to 100, if at all, who defend it as an ego thing as this is the only game/genre they play and they need it to compensate for something but that is a psychological problem and you have a few of those everywhere, no offense.


I second this approach. Let's stop making people feel bad for playing the game. Reward them for doing good. The game feels very vindictive right now, as if the Devs hate the players and want them to suffer at every turn. I'm sure that's not their intent but that's where we are at. There's already too much penalty for dying as it is. Having to Lose the map, or in campaign resetting all of your progress, sucks massive Donkey balls as it is. Adding XP penalty on top of everything else is just a step too far. Especially when most deaths are once again from un avoidable BS, like random mobs with insane mods, and things you don't see until it kills you. And once again there is no way to learn from your mistakes. Even Diablo 1 over 30 years ago told you what killed you. Just saying.
I'm stuck at level 92, TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT DEFENSES I NEED but for the life of me I don't know what I died to for the nth time. It's been 3 days since I progressed and it's starting to get to me. I wanna like endgame but there's glaring issues with it in its current form.

1 portal, -xp death penalty but not even a death recap in softcore so we can learn the game to git gud?
Imagine liking only certain types of build or a specific set of builds being able to reach end game, limiting the freedom and veriety of builds.... Imagine liking that.
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Imagine liking only certain types of build or a specific set of builds being able to reach end game, limiting the freedom and veriety of builds.... Imagine liking that.


That's exactly why many veterans support xp punishment: cause they know exactly what to do to keep a healthy distance to new players. This way they control the market and profit through selling high tier items and carry services.

With every season start, NOONE of these players enjoys the game's freedom, they use their proven builds created years ago, which are proven viable to keep the xp distance up. And they won't suffer from punishments due to these builds. This is the reason why there are veterans supporting this.
Last edited by AngryGekko#0233 on Jan 5, 2025, 10:57:34 AM
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BK2710#6123 wrote:
The entire debacle can be solved by moving the punishment to a reward instead. Reward deathless completion chains with stacking xp/item bonuses and maybe a currency for it so the "really good" players can get some unique items someone who dies every now and then cannot.

Bad feeling converted to a rewarding feeling, everyone wins.

Alternatively, opt-in features via toggles or a league akin to SSF on char creation. No side has to give up anything and everyone stands to gain from it. The only losers are those with malicious intend/vested interest in botting/RMT/selling services which is a problem to begin with.

There are a few people who barely make it to 100, if at all, who defend it as an ego thing as this is the only game/genre they play and they need it to compensate for something but that is a psychological problem and you have a few of those everywhere, no offense.


+1
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"
Imagine liking only certain types of build or a specific set of builds being able to reach end game, limiting the freedom and veriety of builds.... Imagine liking that.


That's exactly why many veterans support xp punishment: cause they know exactly what to do to keep a healthy distance to new players. This way they control the market and profit through selling high tier items and carry services.

With every season start, NOONE of these players enjoys the game's freedom, they use their proven builds created years ago, which are proven viable to keep the xp distance up. And they won't suffer from punishments due to these builds. The only way to end this is removing xp loss as it mainly hurts the newcomers, not the veterans.


It's less clever than that.

It's just tribalism. This game is their identity, and hitting certain thresholds makes them feel special.

Therefore anything that makes it easier for the non-special peasantry to hit the same thresholds is a threat to their own special status.

Seen same behaviour on other games when it comes to looking for ways to increase accessibility for things.
Last edited by mrfox123#7595 on Jan 5, 2025, 10:59:21 AM
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MEITTI#3999 wrote:
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MadSheo#0280 wrote:


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2. Edlen Ring

Lot of grind and very unforgiving XP penalties on that game.




Have you actually played Elden Ring or any of the other Souls-likes? This isn't true at all. Literally none of them have unforgiving exp penalties. Demon's Souls is the most harsh by cutting your life in half when dying, and that's still not related to exp penalties. When you die in these games, you always have an opportunity to go get your Souls/runes/exp back, and there are frequent checkpoints you can use to use that exp and never lose too much progress. There are points where it can be hard to progress until you can overcome, but you never get sent backwards in terms of progression.
Last edited by avastcosmicarena#5899 on Jan 5, 2025, 11:02:14 AM
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Have you actually played Elden Ring or any of the other Souls-likes? This isn't true at all. Literally none of them have unforgiving exp penalties. Demon's Souls is the most harsh by cutting your life in half when dying, and that's still not related to exp penalties. When you die in these games, you always have an opportunity to go get your Souls/runes/exp back, and there are frequent checkpoints you can use to use that exp and never lose too much progress. There are points where it can be hard to progress until you can overcome, but you never get sent backwards in terms of progression.


You can also safely farm resources in easy content to overpower any obstacle if you want to.
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mrfox123#7595 wrote:
"
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Imagine liking only certain types of build or a specific set of builds being able to reach end game, limiting the freedom and veriety of builds.... Imagine liking that.


That's exactly why many veterans support xp punishment: cause they know exactly what to do to keep a healthy distance to new players. This way they control the market and profit through selling high tier items and carry services.

With every season start, NOONE of these players enjoys the game's freedom, they use their proven builds created years ago, which are proven viable to keep the xp distance up. And they won't suffer from punishments due to these builds. The only way to end this is removing xp loss as it mainly hurts the newcomers, not the veterans.


It's less clever than that.

It's just tribalism. This game is their identity, and hitting certain thresholds makes them feel special.

Therefore anything that makes it easier for the non-special peasantry to hit the same thresholds is a threat to their own special status.

Seen same behaviour on other games when it comes to looking for ways to increase accessibility for things.


When I look at their profile I expect to see 40/40 challenges every league, and that's barely the case, you see some 15 chall here and 20 chall there, a bunch of level 90-95 chars. I'm confused.
Never seen such a huge pile of bs and crybabies. Xp loss is perfectly fine and every decent build is pretty maxed out and can do any content in the game at lvl 90 anyway so u dont need lvl 100 and u sure as hell should not get there by corpse running and throwing ur rotten carcass at map bosses. U already have this game... its called D4, their player retention clearly shows that its not the way to go. Some people actually likes the challenge and the time it takes to get to lvl 100 and it keeps some players engaged for more than 1 week on a new league. Lvl 100 is not meant for every build nor is it a prerequisite for anything in the game and if u feel like ur time is wasted by loosing 10% xp because u die even though u have gained a lot of loot in the meantime thats on u and not the game. So in the end suck it up or move on cause xp loss is here to stay as it should be.

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