This league is GROSS. Not playing it.
" Not sure I necessarily agree, meta skills are either very strong, very good for the respective league's mechanic or very popular for being fun (i.e. TS wasn't THAT good of a skill but it was just fun to use and people enjoy the rangey playstyle). But I have never ever seen a meta skill that isn't at least slightly above average when compared to a number of other skills. Especially lately I play a lot of meta builds as I don't have the time or patience required to experiment with my own shit anymore. Which is a bit sad, but you take what you can get. Now, whether or not meta skills are the absolute best or strongest - that's kind of a dumb take because no skill will be the best at everything, obviously. But they're generally well rounded and can do most things at least okay or better. RF is a niche build because it's very good for new or very casual players, older players, people with no mechanical skill or people who have medical issues arm/shoulder-related. It's very simple to use and requires no prior knowledge or mechanical skill. I find it incredibly boring but some people just want to roll like that and that's fine. But RF was never "meta" or particularly strong and nobody ever said it was. It is widely recognized for its simplicity and for being noobie-friendly, not for being one of the best. A build that can be played by literally anyone, even people with certain disabilities which is pretty awesome. A lot of people will take simplicity over an OP skill. But that's not because of a guide - people were playing RF even before pohx and his amazing guide. Having a detailed guide is an excellent fit for the category of people that RF addresses, yes. But if you ask any player what you should play, they won't say "play RF because it's super strong" they'll say "play RF if it's your first league". Almost every game has a "best for beginners" thing, and it's almost never the best or the strongest, but it's beginner friendly and that's what its purpose is. Last edited by Felix44#4475 on Nov 10, 2025, 3:57:19 PM
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" meta for this game is sadly just whatever is popular on ninja. Thats what it is for the majority of players. You can get into what you think is better or worse for people more advanced, but ultimately its just whatever popular is on ninja. Thats what meta is for POE. Which happens to be the builds that have guides right before launch. Just how it is. That doesnt mean you cant find something off meta that is better or similar in power. And it doesnt even mean meta is strong at anything particular to begin with (RF is a perfect example) Most effective tactics available is just whatever has a guide. As that is the hardest part, or really, the only hard part about poe is making a build that works. So for the extreme majority of players... Meta = ninja popularity = whatever guides came out pre league launch. Mash the clean Last edited by Mashgesture#2912 on Nov 10, 2025, 7:52:00 PM
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" Nobody is saying if a skill isn't meta it can't be strong. But meta skills are meta because they are guaranteed to be strong, well-rounded and capable to do all content on a decent investment (under 50 div), while being easy to scale or respec into endgame. Which is what most people are looking to play. RF is sort of an exception due to reasons I explained above. But it still fits all the above criteria even if it is weaker than most other meta skills. The point I am trying to make here is that meta skills = guaranteed to be strong enough to do all content on a decent investment. A non meta skill may or may not be able to do that. I fully agree with you that yes, making your own build is the only hard part of POE, but it also requires a tremendous amount of time and knowledge which most players won't be willing or able to dedicate. I personally don't believe that certain skills (i.e. Cleave) can ever be as objectively strong as meta skills - that is to say, capable to do the same content with the same proficiency and at the same investment. Not to say I can't be wrong - you probably know the game way better than I do - just...haven't seen it yet and won't believe it until I do. A skill's strength can be measured in what it can do, how fast/well it can do it and how much it costs to do it. Compare Cleave with say, KB - I personally don't see a world where Cleave (as it is right now) comes up on top, and I think that's the point that the previous poster was trying to make. Some skills are just objectively worse than others. Last edited by Felix44#4475 on Nov 10, 2025, 8:09:09 PM
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" Didnt say that either. " Yea. Cause it has a guide for it. Its guarenteed as all the legwork was done already. A lot of skills could be meta that aren't for a variety of reasons. Not anything to do with their power either. Its just whatever gained the most views before league launch. Its sad but true. " Yea I mean I wouldnt beable to come to that conclusion either. I dont think anyone has as well. Sid has posted several times that cleave/sweep are not viable. So we arent even to the matching of meta type of power level. See here:
Spoiler
 We are like bare bones can do all content. When we discuss(ed) those skills. In this thread. You're responding to something that I dont think anyone said. Further though. I think if I gave meta in the hands of several users on this forum. I would outperform them, hand over fist, with heavy strike. You could go farther and say you could give me meta, and then Alkaizer would outperform me with dual strike. Or Art in this thread will outperform me with flamewood totems. I think thats the discintion you should realize. Just because there is a meta on POE doesnt mean those people have any clue what they are doing. Or even have anything efficient set up. Mash the clean
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Can we just take a second and remind ourselves that this discussion is footed on an OP who didn't complete Act 3 before saying "melee sucks"
Any discussion beyond viability of melee in Act 3 is unnecessary The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge.
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" Been playing the game 10y. Reading comprehension is a perishable skill. |
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" I been practicing the guitar on and off for years. Wouldn't say I'm any good at it. Point was, you are commenting on the viability of a build archetype without having played more than 3 hours. The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge. Last edited by ArtCrusade#4438 on Nov 10, 2025, 10:40:37 PM
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" Its actually both. Lazy gameplay is great but to do it one must know game mechanics. And guide is kinda like that. So we have nice guide to lazy gamepley. I personally learned a lot from my first RF char and i love lazy gameplay. I hate piano like thing and cannot understand how would anyone want play something like that but... A lot of players see it differently and its OK. |
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" You’re either new to the game or haven’t really played melee, because this archetype has been fine for ages. Even the "meme" skills work perfectly fine. You’d only miss that if you blindly follow whatever top streamer claims is the latest, greatest, and supposedly indispensable melee powerhouse. This archetype doesn’t need hype, it’s solid, reliable, and has been carrying its own weight for years, even during its worst days when actual memes like melee totems were a thing, and overall player power was way lower. Windows 11, 9950X3D, RTX 4090, 96GB DDR5, 14,100 MB/s SSD, 15,360x2160p @240Hz Ultra 4K Gaming & Workspace Powerhouse
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