SOLUTION for the hyperinflated Divine Orb issue and Rarity of Items Issue

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Zamolxes7#5151 wrote:

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Pl4t1numX#4325 wrote:

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Cornholio777#1511 wrote:

Basically, the game is a bank which prints money (Currency) but the money that is created is not being used as intended by developers.
Currencies needs to be used and deleted to keep a good balance in the market, but at the moment Divine Orbs are not being deleted enough.

i dont know why people open up solution threads for problems if they dont even understand the basics of the problem.

divine's are not expensive because of no sinks, and more sinks for them would increase their value even more. your solution would make it even worse. if something is rare and the demand high, the item is expensive. if the demand is higher the item is more expensive. i dont know whats so hard to understand here.

This is what confuses me, people keep saying there are too many divines and the price of them in exalts is going up. I think most people do not understand inflation at all. As you said, if there were fewer divines they would probably be worth 300-400 exalts each, making the problem even worse.

Is it time to have an economics 101 class for the POE community? What a weird thread!

To be fair, the original thread was about the value of items skyrocketing in the number of divines expected.

You see a lot of top tier rares go from 100d to over 200d in the past few weeks.

There are two problems with divines right now, they are far too rare compared to exalts creating the current ex:d ratio AND high end items are going up in divine prices.


So it's possible that divines are both too rare and too rarely used creating the situation where their value skyrockets compared to the fairly common exalts, but drops compared to top tier gear.

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Mordgier#6997 wrote:

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Zamolxes7#5151 wrote:

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Pl4t1numX#4325 wrote:

i dont know why people open up solution threads for problems if they dont even understand the basics of the problem.

divine's are not expensive because of no sinks, and more sinks for them would increase their value even more. your solution would make it even worse. if something is rare and the demand high, the item is expensive. if the demand is higher the item is more expensive. i dont know whats so hard to understand here.

This is what confuses me, people keep saying there are too many divines and the price of them in exalts is going up. I think most people do not understand inflation at all. As you said, if there were fewer divines they would probably be worth 300-400 exalts each, making the problem even worse.

Is it time to have an economics 101 class for the POE community? What a weird thread!

To be fair, the original thread was about the value of items skyrocketing in the number of divines expected.

You see a lot of top tier rares go from 100d to over 200d in the past few weeks.

There are two problems with divines right now, they are far too rare compared to exalts creating the current ex:d ratio AND high end items are going up in divine prices.


So it's possible that divines are both too rare and too rarely used creating the situation where their value skyrockets compared to the fairly common exalts, but drops compared to top tier gear.

This! ^^^^ You understand the issue completely, nice reply.
A lot of people in this thread don't understand the chain of values reacting to each other. But you explain it very well here. Thanks :D

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Mordgier#6997 wrote:

So it's possible that divines are both too rare and too rarely used creating the situation where their value skyrockets compared to the fairly common exalts, but drops compared to top tier gear.

for sure if they would be used more, they would have less value. wait, what? makes no sense buddy

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Pl4t1numX#4325 wrote:

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Mordgier#6997 wrote:

So it's possible that divines are both too rare and too rarely used creating the situation where their value skyrockets compared to the fairly common exalts, but drops compared to top tier gear.

for sure if they would be used more, they would have less value. wait, what? makes no sense buddy

Reading is hard. They are both too rare and thus too rarely used and as a result hoarded like some PoE stable coin.

How many divines have you slammed into gear?

How about exalts?

You use exalts by the dozen daily because they are trivial to get and thus slamming them on gear is common.

If you find a divine, you don't go "Hey let me slam it on that Vector and see what happens".

Instead you hoard them. So they are both rare and NOT used - but hoarded.

This creates the funky situation where the value of divines compared to exalts continues to drift and also the number of divines in the economy continues to increase since they are not actually used much.

This is why top tier gear continues to go up in price in terms of divines, as end game farmers have more divines now that they had time to farm them. At the same time those entering the end game who are finding tons of exalts are left behind as they are no longer able to convert those exalts to divines at a reasonable rate and are cut off from buying top tier gear through farming exalts - they depend on finding gear they can sell for divines or finding raw divines neither of which is reliable or predictable farming method.

exalts are used far less because crafting sucks atm. divines are used on uniques mostly. the balance isnt right there and we need more exalt sinks.
but saying with more divine usage the value would be lower is just wrong.

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Pl4t1numX#4325 wrote:

exalts are used far less because crafting sucks atm. divines are used on uniques mostly. the balance isnt right there and we need more exalt sinks.
but saying with more divine usage the value would be lower is just wrong.

I specifically said the price of GEAR in divines would be lower.

Because players using divines would mean there are fewer sitting around in stashes.

I have ZERO use for my divines except to hoard them until I see an upgrade - which at this stage is going to cost me 50d+.

I throw exalts on maps and dropped gear regularly to see if maybe something good will come of it - because the exalt to me has no real value.

Maybe im wrong but from my point of view it seems as if 2 things are the absolute biggest culprints when it comes to inflation.

The first thing is Droprates:
- the problem is - beeing high level with good gear and maps doesnt only give you better gear - which is perfectly fine - it also gives you ridiculous ammounts of loot and standard gear/currency

The issue with this is - this devaluetes currency and items so fast that most ppl will just be left behind in this economy - which probably also explains why goldsellers are becomming more and more of an issue since people seem to compensate by doign the absolutely worst thing possible.


Also Goldsellers can also use these mechanics to farm absurd ammounts of loot compared to normal players.


The second thing is Divines:
- i think one of the main issues is that Divines dont have anye use that stands in relation to their droprate and worth - therefore they have become a currency 99% of the time and one of the few items that actually not only keep but also increase their worth

I think this is also bad for the game since it makes inflation even worse.


It is really alarming looking at how fast the price is rising - and it seems to be getting faster and faster.


I would propose a few changes:

Divines
- add some use for Divines in mapping - good enough for ppl thinking about using them
- or maybe even do something like - undo corruption block for 10 divine (keep stats but another try) with some sort of limit - like 1-3 times at max per item and max stats

-and maybe also extra uses for exalts to reduce their number - but if droprates werent so extreme at the end that probably wouldnt be needed (endgame should drop great loot - not millions of orb-currencies)


Droprates
- increase the Droprate in campaign until Level 60 - this will improve gameplay fun and reward while not impacting endgame market

- decrease the difference in droprate between best and worst so that they arent so extreme that ppl are left behind instantly

- maybe add some endgame-use for items mainly dropped in lower level areas - or make them a good income for gold so ppl also have some sort of chance to not get completely obliterated when they join the endgame-market (for example make some of the low level currency or even shards drop more in low level areas and increase the gold you get for them from the merchant etc.)

May i add - i think the best time to mess and play arround with balancing this is now.

Currency actually needs to be used by players.
If players are hoarding it which they are, the currency value will always keep dropping.
Exalts and Divines are more used for trading than its actual ability, and trading does not remove them from the game.

As I'm writing this, the exalt to divine ration is 310 ex to 1 div.
It's never been this high I believe in PoE1, and I predict it will just keep going up.

Divine Orbs usage is terrible as discussed.
If you could choose, would you use 1 Divine Orb to improve a current item (in a general sense any rare item) by what, 1-5%? With a big change it actually being worse so to actually have a change to get a good roll maybe you need an average of 5 or 10 div?
OR, will you use that 1 or 5 or 10 div, for an obvious 200%, 500% or even 1000% improvement on your stats.

And for Exalts. They are used sparingly. Noone slams item after item with exalts because they're still more worth in the trade even tho Exalts value is also dropping every day, because this is better used for TRADING then to gamble on items for a 0.1% chance of actually getting a good item.

The choice is obvious. GGG needs to tweak the droprate to better reflect the value of the ability, and GGG needs to measure that value against what the same value gets a person on the trade.

So again, for Divine Orb. Change the ability completely to "Randomises the tier of the modifiers on an item".
This is actually strong, and some people might say OP but I honestly dont think so if its balanced correctly and Divine orb drops are rare and with this ability, the value would be a lot higher so and the supply lower as Divs are getting deleted from the game so Streamers and pro gamers would not have them in the 1000s.

And add a new currency. For example lets call it "Arcane Orb" or "Astral Orb" or "Ethereal Orb", whatever name and give the original Divine ability to this new currency.
Make this currency drop a lot, because thats how little value the Randomize Numerical Value has. (But maybe should be locked to rare and not uniques, and for uniques either dont have it at all or another Currency just for uniques)
As it would be to OP for very expensive uniques.

Exalts and this new currency Arcane Orb needs to drop even more often, it will drop its value but it needs to be is such great supply so people are using it I think, but maybe I'm wrong on this one.

I don't understand how this game is all about trading and the currency for trading is also so hard to earn, which make it so only ''rich'' players with extreme luck and broken builds are able to take advatange of the system.
Why there is a crafting system in PoE 1, but not in PoE 2? Why they want this game to be all ''luck'' based?
Divines are so rare, that they should be able to actually allow the player to either upgrade a tier of an affix or actually allow you to choose which affix + tier you want for an item. The current system is a failure.