Annual reminder that XP loss on death is bad design.

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Dxt44#4050 wrote:

It's kinda weird thing to say. I would say that it can be achievement if you play some janky build and you have 200 hours in the game.

Watching the same topics pop up every single league, it really does start to feel like an impossible achievement for some players. At this point, I honestly don’t even know what to say.

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VoidWhisperer42#5989 wrote:

It’s fairly evident that hitting level 100 is an actual achievement, if it weren’t, we wouldn’t see the same familiar names lamenting the death penalty every league after getting repeatedly skill-checked and farmed by pixel mobs.

Funny thing, most of my friends that quit the game for the xp loss on death didn’t even care about reaching level 100. They quit because the game has issues that can kill you from nothing, either it’s lag or some over tuned rare, and wastes some hours of gameplay.
Sometimes you just dash into a “patch *of something nasty*”… that is 80% of the map… a patch… GGG doesn’t know the definition of patch.

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TIGRElaranja#2163 wrote:

Funny thing, most of my friends that quit the game for the xp loss on death didn’t even care about reaching level 100. They quit because the game has issues that can kill you from nothing, either it’s lag or some over tuned rare, and wastes some hours of gameplay.
Sometimes you just dash into a “patch *of something nasty*”… that is 80% of the map… a patch… GGG doesn’t know the definition of patch.

I don’t know, but in almost all cases deaths occur for very clear reasons. Most of the time it comes down to player mistakes, taking hits that should never be taken, trying to face-tank obvious and easily avoidable telegraphed attacks, or stepping into positions where getting instantly deleted is almost guaranteed. Then there’s ignoring map modifiers, not understanding how dramatically certain mods can affect a build, or running setups with poorly chosen defensive layers that simply don’t synergize.

It’s genuinely rare for a character to just collapse out of nowhere for no discernible cause. Nearly every death has an understandable explanation, and a clear reason why it happened.

And honestly, even if GGG introduced a full death log like Last Epoch did, it probably wouldn’t give many players any meaningful insight into what actually went wrong. Instead, we’d likely just see more threads along the lines of, “Oh no, [insert random damage type or attack] is overtuned because it killed me”.

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VoidWhisperer42#5989 wrote:

And honestly, even if GGG introduced a full death log like Last Epoch did, it probably wouldn’t give many players any meaningful insight into what actually went wrong. Instead, we’d likely just see more threads along the lines of, “Oh no, [insert random damage type or attack] is overtuned because it killed me”.

Literally last patch:

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Fixed a bug where some Ignites inflicted by a handful of endgame bosses were dealing up to 2-3 times the damage they should be. The affected bosses were: The Enslaver, Sasan the Bandit Lord, Vic Vox, and Nashta The Usurper.

It could be fixed long ago.

The problem is trade exists. So people can buy gear to get into content theyre not ready for that gives them a false sense of security. Most people get into red maps with no business being there. Then they just get farmed by monsters.

There are defensive thresholds for red maps that sc players don't respect because nothing matters in sc.

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Lonnie455Rich#2087 wrote:

The problem is trade exists. So people can buy gear to get into content theyre not ready for that gives them a false sense of security. Most people get into red maps with no business being there. Then they just get farmed by monsters.

There are defensive thresholds for red maps that sc players don't respect because nothing matters in sc.

That's not all, though. They notice they keep dying, but they refuse to learn why, or what they can change about their characters to improve their odds. XP penalty is a good reminder to not play recklessly and to respect monsters and their modifiers.

This thread is funny in that OP complains about the penalty and even says "I got them ideas how to fix it" but won't elaborate. Like... what?

The map corruption system from PoE2 is interesting, but if it was just a stand-in for XP penalty just everyone would reach 100 eventually by failing upwards. Map sustain already is a non-issue, so even if you said loot gets locked or the map becomes more deadly after a RIP, you could just open another.

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Lonnie455Rich#2087 wrote:

The problem is trade exists. So people can buy gear to get into content theyre not ready for that gives them a false sense of security. Most people get into red maps with no business being there. Then they just get farmed by monsters.

There are defensive thresholds for red maps that sc players don't respect because nothing matters in sc.

Its SC Trade, its supposed to be the easy-mode of the game. There is no such thing as being ready or not being ready for maps. You just buy your 6-link and start blasting. That's what the game is in that mode, exp loss has no place in it. Again, all it does is force people to play boring,safe content until they level up. Or give more profits to the 5-way legion rota hosts lmao

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Toforto#2372 wrote:

Its SC Trade, its supposed to be the easy-mode of the game. There is no such thing as being ready or not being ready for maps. You just buy your 6-link and start blasting. That's what the game is in that mode, exp loss has no place in it. Again, all it does is force people to play boring,safe content until they level up. Or give more profits to the 5-way legion rota hosts lmao

+ let's not forget that the 10% flat xp loss is not really fair because if you die on let's say lv 80 when a t5 map gives you like 40% xp is not really the same as dying on lv 99 when 2 t16 gives you 1% xp.

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Ispita#4020 wrote:

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Toforto#2372 wrote:

Its SC Trade, its supposed to be the easy-mode of the game. There is no such thing as being ready or not being ready for maps. You just buy your 6-link and start blasting. That's what the game is in that mode, exp loss has no place in it. Again, all it does is force people to play boring,safe content until they level up. Or give more profits to the 5-way legion rota hosts lmao

+ let's not forget that the 10% flat xp loss is not really fair because if you die on let's say lv 80 when a t5 map gives you like 40% xp is not really the same as dying on lv 99 when 2 t16 gives you 1% xp.

Exactly. Dying at lvl98 or 99 is such a bigger punishment. That's hours and hours of mapping deleted in an instant, because you got the 1 in 1000 unlucky archnemesis combo on a mob, or you lagged a bit or x,y and z happened in that order. Its just really bad. I just live in Sanctum until I get my desired level, since there's almost 0 risk of dying in there.

It is the ezmode of the game yes, but it doesn't have to be completely pain free. You are supposed to progress in games like these. Not just get things handed to you.

You stated the problem yourself. You just get your 6l and blast. That is the problem, I don't know how else to spell it out for you. You are completely bypassing part of the game buying up gear like that to skip progression.

Too many games nowadays that let someone log in on day 1 with no previous work and if they have good reflexes and hand eye coordination they're on a level playing field with someone with 2k hours into the game. FPS games put this mindset into people that there should be no progress. That is not the point of an arpg. Arpgs focus on character progression and power fantasy(somehow poe added stock market to this). If you skip half the game you're setting yourself up for being bored early in the league.

Also if you don't build defense and cant survive thats your fault. Did you know that more people complain about soul eater in sc than hc? ive never once been scared of a soul eater mob in hc. The burial chambers boss can make your heart skip a beat sometimes but rares are nothing.

That progression also isn't boring easy content that you speak of if you just play the game instead of trying to trade up gear to skip progression. The progression can be smooth if you literally just play the game and ignore trade until you start doing voidstones. People just want to farm a mageblood in endless heist so they can just speed farm to t16s and do some mindless currency farming strat then complain not enough divine orbs fall on the ground because they're too lazy to figure out how to make currency without a youtube video.

dying at 98-99 in sc is not huge punishment. If you're level 99 and can't stay alive thats on you.