Armour should mitigate elemental damage.
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Un-evadable elemental spells deal a huge amount of damage in higher level maps which particularly affects life based builds. On the contrary there is plenty of physical and chaos mitigation available for life based builds. Evasion and armour primarily mitigate physical damage which brings these builds in line with energy shield builds and chaos damage is heavily mitigated at 75% chaos resist.
The current methods to mitigate elemental damage include: - fortify - enfeeble (blasphemy for melee builds) - +Max resistance, usually requires changes to flask setup for heavy single elemental bosses. Realistically capped at 85% resistance for end game characters that don't specialise; purity + flask. The summation of these gives around 68% elemental mitigation if you setup for a boss that uses a single element, such as crematorium. Unfortunately most bosses use a diverse range of elements, and so realistically only fortify and enfeeble apply. This means there is around 0.8*0.87 = ~30% elemental mitigation against end game bosses. Elemental damage for end game bosses is clearly balanced around hitting extremely hard assuming you can mitigate a significant amount. Energy shield that recovers fast is able to provide a far larger buffer zone for elemental damage than life builds. Life builds typically have armour or can obtain it (iron reflexes for evasion characters), while it is significantly harder for ES characters. As such I recommend that armour should mitigate elemental damage to such an extent that significant elemental damage deals less than a 6K hit with great armour, and less than 4k with extreme amounts of armour. Furthermore, this would assist with the balancing of volatiles which can even one shot certain close combat ES builds. Taking chaos inoculation could void the elemental mitigation from armour as this would be intended for life builds that take armour and evasion defences. In conclusion, physical and chaos mitigation is fine due to the several layers of defence that apply to it. Elemental damage needs mitigation options unique to life based builds. Energy shield should remain the best option for mitigation considering the investment, but investment into life based defenses for life based builds should provide equivalent levels of mitigation for equivalent levels of investment; that is, mirror worthy armour should be just as good as mirror worthy ES. Last edited by RichardFox#2870 on Nov 26, 2016, 1:41:03 AM Last bumped on Nov 28, 2016, 1:16:17 PM
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IMO
There should be two types of armor: - x% armor that reduce all incoming physical damage by ALWAYS x% (no matter how strong the hit is) (good versus strong hits, it should work exactly like current elementa resists) - x armor that reduce all incoming physical damage by x value (good versus small hits) Evasion should be changed purely into x% dodge for attacks and spells speratly. I always hate the x ratio into x% calculations in games, so clunky mechanic. Elemental resist should stay in x% as it is now, but in lower values without the "diffuclty penatlies". The penalty is nothing more than another clunky mechanic. The reduced values need to make people have chance to diffretnate builds instead of everybody going max resists. On the end armor and elemental resists would be on par with their usefulness - mechanic need to be unified and simple to understand. Elemental resist should also get x value reduction just like armor change. ES should be removed since the concept is nothing more than second HP bar - we dont need two of those. Give more tools for HP just like option to change it to recharge style with some uniques. This remove the whole problem of balancing those two concepts. In conclusion - comparing armor parts NOW and AFTER CHANGE: NOW: - 1000 armor <- player : how much it is? I dont f... know. - 1000 evasion <- player : how much it is? I dont f... know. - 20% fire resist <- I understand it, but why do I need to MAX it? I am not a tank After: - 10% physical resist <- player : Simple, I take 10% less physical damage - 100 physical resist <- player : I take 100 less physical damage - 5% attack dodge <- player :I dodge 5% more attacks than before - 10% fire resist <- player : 10% fire damage less, its worth something Last edited by herflik#4390 on Nov 26, 2016, 6:45:42 AM
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" Spot on. That is exactly the same way I feel regarding the most significant weakness of life / armour based characters. Providing additional means for elemental mitigation via armor would be a huge help / buff and might make armour more attractive alltogether. I'd love to see this implemented in some way. |
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" I find your ideas interesting and thanks for the contribution however I don't agree. Armour and evasion are used with various other forms of mitigation to significantly mitigate damage. You don't simply use just armour or just evasion anymore. See my last paragraph in this post for details. ES is a unique part of the game. It increases the individuality of characters and it would be very impractical to remove. It requires changes, not destruction in my opinion, but not necessarily around ES. I think elemental resistances are ok with their current structure. They are a different way of mitigating damage and it works so it's fine, but it does need tweaking which is why I am suggesting adding armour to assist in mitigation. " Indeed. My current method of mitigation on my character doesn't even use armour. Enfeeble has strong synergies with stibnite and evasion, so I use this to avoid getting hit often. To survive the rare hit I use fortify, enfeeble damage debuff, endurance charges, arctic armour, basalt flask, lightning coil and taste of hate. This gives around 70%-78% physical damage reduction without a drop of armour. |
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I dont think its rly fair to evasion builds to just give that to armour and say well IR is how you get this for evasion.
I think a healthy situation would be that (while sticking to their core stat defense methods) a witch is better at defending from elemental spells than a duelist and the duelist is better at defending from physical attacks than the witch. This is probably true atm but I dont think the balance of it all is correct, the extent of the superiority and how much that matters. Theres many factors to the whole thing and Im not sure what Id change personally. I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :)
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" Remove zealots oath, remove ghost reaver. Multiply all energy shield nodes by a factor of 1.5, making 20/25k es realistic. Then work on improving the other secondary layers of defense. 15k armor gives +1 max resistance for example(make hard break points that ensure it is a heavily invested character that receives the bonuses, exclude outside sources like gaurdians or generosity aura boost's for its calculation) 10k evasion gives 10% reduced damage to a hit every 4 seconds (20k could either give 20% reduced or decrease the reset time to 3 seconds etc etc) Make bonuses for reaching threshold value's that can only realistically be achieved with heavy investment. this makes them relevant in end-game, while having low impact early game where the defenses actually still hold up on their own. At least, that's one possible route to make them attractive and different game-play wise. Peace, -Boem- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes
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" was going to suggest something similar to what you just said. the reason why armor and eva feel weak is becouse they are only partialy usefull and as such is not a good idea to invest heavily into something that only works half the time. guardian is indeed a problem and i think we can all agree that an aura that gives tons of armor or ES to allys is a bit OP but the solution is simple, radiant faith gives full boost to self and minions, ally players would receive it but only at 25% effectivness wich is still good but not crazy high like now. self found league fan
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/324242/page/1 |
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" Removing those keystones would be incredibly detrimental to CI builds and any related ES builds. Would kill any possibility of using RF for ES builds. Unless, they make ES recharge startup near instantaneous and at double the recharge rate. I miss the Elemental Adaptation notable and old Purity combo days. It help to be 80 max ele resistances as melee and tank all those elemental damages. With Saffell's Frame, you take up the notch further, but at the cost losing out a lot of armor from shield and cannot block attacks. While it hurt Evasion having a hard time with this, they also had much better Acrobatics keystone and Arrow Dodging/Ondar's Guile (Arrow Dancing is a joke). Dodge + block combo was a thing back then. I think GGG intentionally hurt Armor and Evasion to make you invest in even more defense at the cost of offense, but it kinda backfired with the whole clearspeed meta BS. Sometimes you can take the game out of the garage but you can't take the garage out of the game. - raics, 06.08.2016 Last edited by JohnNamikaze#6516 on Nov 26, 2016, 3:10:17 PM
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" My intention with that is not to kill/hurt build diversity, but drastically address the game-play and "blue life". If players turn back to the point where they are allowed 25k/35K es buffers, but without ability's to recharge it inside battles you alter the game-style associated with ES. Obviously, GGG would then have the possibility to sprinkle more and generous "increased start of recharge%" nodes in the relevant parts of the passive tree if that is desired at that point. " What i meant in my post was the following => The attributes i described would only be calculated based on "local value's" - passive tree% - base item value's - local aura enhancements - flasks that apply local buffs In this scenario, a gaurdian would be considered a global value, since it is not directly located on the character itself, similarly generosity aura bots etc would not apply to this second layer of defense unlocked at threshold value's. In my example, if you reach 30k armor locally, you would gain +2 max all resistances. If a gaurdian would push it to 50k armor, it would still use the 30k value to calculate +2 max all resistances of the threshold bonus, though the physical base reduction the armor calculation uses would use 50k. Otherwise, you would have severe abuse cases if you allow outside interactions with such a potent secondary layer. Since it specifically rewards "local" heavy investment it needs to be rewarding but detached from globally gained attributes. Peace, -Boem- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes
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remove everything, the talent tree is now mine sweeper but without the indicators
Ancestral Bond. It's a thing that does stuff. -Vipermagi
He who controls the pants controls the galaxy. - Rick & Morty S3E1 |
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