[3.5] Occultist Cold DoT Caster (Cold Snap + Vortex) WIP

"

DevilsmilE wrote:

I think you are vastly underestimating the usefulness of the quiver with all the slow we are getting.

Really? Again, no offence, but have you tried to play without the quiver yet?

I mean, even with the recharge debuff of Rime Gaze I had literally no problems steamrolling through the game.

Syndicate bosses fall in 2-3secs regardless of tier, Guardians, Atziri etc. are piece of cake.

Yes, I havent tried Uber/red tier Elder yet, but from what I have seen till now I strongly believe that they will not be a big challange either, and I'm sitting pretty much on the same amount of ES than you.

At a certain point I just don't value extra defences any more. But hey, thats just me and my opinion. :)


take care.

"

s0mosh wrote:

"

DevilsmilE wrote:

I think you are vastly underestimating the usefulness of the quiver with all the slow we are getting.

Really? Again, no offence, but have you tried to play without the quiver yet?

I have switched over from a Staff build, and to me, the difference was day and night. With flasks up i have 11k evasion, so the difference between 0.8sec and 2sec are a huge QOL to me as i can play a LOT more aggressively without having to worry about interrupting the recharge timer. Btw, to come out to similar damage as a +3 bow with 70% cold damage, you would need a staff, which imo just arent worth it as we are already dealing more than enough.

"

s0mosh wrote:

"

arbredeplastic wrote:

i saw you want to push the thing to its limit.

I think the limiting factor here is the bow setup, which i kinda dont understand.

Why the bow? Because it's cheap? Don't tell me cause of the ES regen from the quiver^^.

I mean, you get a Rime Gaze and a Spine of the First Claimant for 11c, which will do plenty more damage than the bow plus you are able to use a shield.


With this setup I'm sitting at 2.1m Shaper dot dps right now (without any flask or Vaal RF, with ca. 4.2m) which isn't even end of the line dps wise.


So, without crazy gear 1.5m shouold be doable relatively easy whithout sacrificing defences.


Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of trying something new/not being part of the hoard, but am I missing some noticable benefit from a bow setup here?


take care.

Well bow + quiver setup is actually both defensively and offensively superior.

1. +3 bow and empower in Vortex setup will give much more damage then 1h + shield would. +x to levels on DoT skills is very powerful, even with introduction of Cold DoT multiplier. Not to mention 2 stacking 6linked DoTs (3 if you count Vaal CS).
2. Just because you can steamroll everything without the quiver recharge buff (and I know you can, I have a couple of friends also playing this build but without the bow) doesn't mean it is useless, for one thing - it is a huge QoL improvement. Everyone has different playstyles and goals. I love as much defense as I can find, while having good offence still. And also yes, I wanted to do something differently, although build was created before league started, so I didn't even know what the "proper" way would be)

From my personal experience, the Faster Start of ES Regen is absolutely invaluable. It's saved my ass countless times when getting spiked with damage. Having said that, there's better ways of getting it while still maintaining higher DPS.

Ring -> 12-17% faster Regen, 1 regal craft
Ring -> 18-24% faster Regen, 1 ex craft
Jewel -> 30-40% faster Regen, ~1-2ex Watcher's Eye

With the regal craft and a 37% Watcher's Eye I have 51% faster regen. Sure I lose out on 30% from the quiver, but I get to dual wield and cast more spells via the 'Cast Socketed Spells when you use a Skill' affix OR use an ES shield, both of which net more DPS without losing much in the way of recovery.

"

ValonKarrde wrote:

From my personal experience, the Faster Start of ES Regen is absolutely invaluable. It's saved my ass countless times when getting spiked with damage. Having said that, there's better ways of getting it while still maintaining higher DPS.

Ring -> 12-17% faster Regen, 1 regal craft
Ring -> 18-24% faster Regen, 1 ex craft
Jewel -> 30-40% faster Regen, ~1-2ex Watcher's Eye

With the regal craft and a 37% Watcher's Eye I have 51% faster regen. Sure I lose out on 30% from the quiver, but I get to dual wield and cast more spells via the 'Cast Socketed Spells when you use a Skill' affix OR use an ES shield, both of which net more DPS without losing much in the way of recovery.

The more the better, i personally will be getting the watchers eye on top of the quiver for maximum immortality. Without the quiver its ALWAYS -80%, not 30 or whatever else.

Also as Agr1as said, you would be hardpressured to out dps a +3 bow with 70% cold on a 1h/shield setup, you will have more base ES but thats it.

"

ValonKarrde wrote:

From my personal experience, the Faster Start of ES Regen is absolutely invaluable. It's saved my ass countless times when getting spiked with damage. Having said that, there's better ways of getting it while still maintaining higher DPS.

Ring -> 12-17% faster Regen, 1 regal craft
Ring -> 18-24% faster Regen, 1 ex craft
Jewel -> 30-40% faster Regen, ~1-2ex Watcher's Eye

With the regal craft and a 37% Watcher's Eye I have 51% faster regen. Sure I lose out on 30% from the quiver, but I get to dual wield and cast more spells via the 'Cast Socketed Spells when you use a Skill' affix OR use an ES shield, both of which net more DPS without losing much in the way of recovery.

First of all - jewel with 18% max mana to ES gives my character about 1050 ES, so exchanging it for recharge start is not ideal, and getting 2 stat Watchers will cost ya about 40-50ex.

Secondly, highly doubt you will get more DPS this way but still it all boils down to personal preference. A bit more defense, a bit more offense - experiment, adapt, have fun) This game is not just about math and perfect setups, its about having fun blowing up thousands of monsters.

P.S. FFS, even life based Occultist version of Cold DoT caster exists and is able to kill Uber Elder, so what are we even arguing about?

"

DevilsmilE wrote:

The more the better, i personally will be getting the watchers eye on top of the quiver for maximum immortality. Without the quiver its ALWAYS -80%, not 30 or whatever else.

Also as Agr1as said, you would be hardpressured to out dps a +3 bow with 70% cold on a 1h/shield setup, you will have more base ES but thats it.

Yeah, you are right. Everything mentioned above about getting faster ES recharge start is also applicable to bow version, so you get even more invulnerable.

Also, on non-related point, just remembered it, if you don't mind sacrificing a craft on chest and a button on skill panel - there is one awesome craft, Ziggy mentioned it in his Cold DoT guide, which recovers 25-30% ES and Mana when you press Focus. And since Focus is instant - it is an ultimate panic button. Tbh, I like Vaal Discipline more, but it has its problem - such as needing souls, which are not always available. But if you get both - dying will be very hard)

Switched to this build, after playing a conscecrated path chieftain as league starter. And the difference was like day and night.

Vortex instant kills most packs including rares, and syndicate members die in one frost bomb/vortex/cold snap combo. Most amazing league starter build ever, after the buffs to vortex and occultist ascendancy.

Was reading earlier posts and many people were complaining abt mana problems. I highly recommend using an Aztri's splendour chest, all my mana problems were gone with it.

"

Agr1as wrote:

Also, on non-related point, just remembered it, if you don't mind sacrificing a craft on chest and a button on skill panel - there is one awesome craft, Ziggy mentioned it in his Cold DoT guide, which recovers 25-30% ES and Mana when you press Focus. And since Focus is instant - it is an ultimate panic button. Tbh, I like Vaal Discipline more, but it has its problem - such as needing souls, which are not always available. But if you get both - dying will be very hard)

To be frank, i would just not give up fenumus chest, i found it to be the ultimate item for this build. The enemies deal reduced damage applies to even shaper without any reduction making is vastly superior to any rare imo.

"

shanwu wrote:

Was reading earlier posts and many people were complaining abt mana problems. I highly recommend using an Aztri's splendour chest, all my mana problems were gone with it.

I think mana could be solved by taking merely 2 nodes, better off with that than a suboptimal chest imho. With might of the meek i managed to get by with only 1 node near arcane will. 144 unreserved mana, 70 mana reg with arcane surge and i cant really run out anymore.

This solves all mana issues and you don't have to use neither a suboptimal chest or spend extra passives. Also get lab enchant on boots, it will make sure you never run out of mana even if you spam all buttons at once.