3.19.0c Patch Notes and Update on Community Feedback

I'll be optimistic and give it ago i feel like this is just a scratch of the surface need way more work.

not sufficient, not even close, also fix minions.

Remove AN mods from Delve especially.....they don't belong there where...EVERY...SINGLE....MOB is a rare or blue pack.

AN shouldn't be in Heist, Temple, or in the Menagerie either. These places were not designed like maps and the mod stacking with many many named in tight spaces makes these places unplayable.

Ass

"

Patch is not out yet?
3.19.0c


My client is 3.19.0b

Same for me. (so got no idea if its patched or not... I even reinstalled the whole game, still showing 3.19.0b)

This feels a bit feeble tbh, looking forward to whatever the further changes are.

My primary issue is the extreme VARIANCE of Archnemesis monster difficulty, it appears to me impossible to balance as long as monsters possess multiple modifiers. Even if each modifier is the same average difficulty (as compared against a player character) when encountered alone, in combination a modifier might have anywhere from no synergy to becoming something akin to an exploit. This compounds the more modifiers a monster possesses.

Think Ice Prison+Assassin kind of combos, these are cool for a player to do because there are thousands of monsters - but a monster doing it is almost like the monster is playing the game and not the player.

I suggested here -
- a change revolving around individual, more elaborate+engaging modifiers and some of the selling points of such a change.

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Let's do an experiment to demonstrate variance, roll 4d100 and compare the total against the difficulty of 1d100. 1d100 represents the difficulty of a single archnemesis modifier on a monster. For this experiment we'll pretend Empowering Minions doesn't exist.

We'll also simulate the further variance from build interaction with simple .5/x2 bounds.

This is an oversimplification but should get the idea across.

Our d100 got a 66, not too bad. That's a 33 when a character has an advantage (think CI against primarily chaos dealing monsters) and 132 when at disadvantage (using the chaos monster example, a low lifer without a solution for chaos bypassing ES). Either an easy fight or a pretty tough but doable fight, which seems about right. 200 is as hard as a fight gets against a single mod monster, and that's a bad matchup against the highest intensity modifier.

However, I got 166 on 4d100 - this represents an easier 4 mod fight than average... but still 2.5 times harder than our harder than average single modifier fight. In a good matchup that's an 83, a moderate encounter. In a bad matchup that's 332, a potentially lethal fight. With a single modifier having a range of 100 and the end of that range being "tough" before build interaction, this is a bit overbearing.

I rolled again and got 309 - a harder 4 mod fight than average, and nearly five times harder than our baseline Rare monster. At 154 for a favorable matchup it's already pretty hard but nothing crazy... however an unfavorable matchup is a 618, this is an extremely lethal fight and probably a short one.

At 400, the theoretical maximum difficulty for a 4 modifier archnemesis rare, the range is 200-800 depending on build matchup. The lower threshold is as hard as a bad matchup against a single modifier rare, and the upper threshold is comically one sided. The range of lethal encounters is from 300-800 (rarely lethal to immediately lethal), or 83% of the encounters with a maximally difficult 4 modifier archnemesis rare.

If Rare monsters were limited to a single modifier, with a difficulty range ending at 200 instead of 100, we can observe tough fights in a good matchup (100) and pretty lethal fights in a bad matchup (400) - this sounds to me like a more engaging spectrum of encounters than 1 to 800 depending on the number of modifiers, their difficulty, and build relevance, wherein 350 is a fair but lethal encounter.

Truth be told the variance is probably much higher, with builds sometimes making a fight 10x easier or harder and the modifiers aren't randomly difficult - they were designed - so the difficulty is not evenly distributed. Variance is of course a huge factor in replay value and generally keeping the game from being monotonous, but it must be bounded to prevent encounters from being disproportionately non-interactive.

I'm not even going to get into the actual drop change, it's an absurdity that it wasn't detailed and discussed publicly prior to implementation. I've been here forever and it's easily the most shocking thing to have happened full stop (and I'm all for hard mode).

"

judikator wrote:

Patch is not out yet?
3.19.0c


My client is 3.19.0b

really, patch is not live???

This is a great start. As always, your hard work is highly appreciated.

I will say tho, there's many other mechanics outside essence and beasts where rare mobs feel impossibly hard. Specially compared with normal rare mobs. Harvest comes to mind.

Also, will this fix that issue when sometimes a full plot of plants in harvest drops no essence at all? that feels AWFUL.

Dead league. I don't think it will recover. We have to wait for new one.
The divine/exalt change... I hate it. Divine don't even have a shard. Doing Harbringer is even more pointless. Exalted was a face (faces) of trade league.