Question regarding the recent bans (Map scyring to force div cards)

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SquierHSS wrote:

I get why people are enraged but honestly this does not seem like a bannable offense to me. From what I understand all used mechanics worked as intended and there was simply an oversight concerning the combination of these mechanics. I find it kind of annoying that we, as players, have to think about which interactions (that work as intended, to be clear) might be illegal and get us banned. This is not a bug, hack or any violation of the ToS. Why is it expected that players who find a combination like that evaluate themselves how much money is an unfair amount and then act accordingly lest GGG swoops in and bans you?

I want to make very clear, that I am no money-making strategist like these people. I don't have the time to put into a league. I do my mapping, am happy when I get my 2 hours of gaming in most days and that's it. I might make 100 Div over the course of an entire league. So again, I get why people get annoyed about others making so much more money. And I too feel like what happened was extremely unfair. But that the use of working mechanics could even be CONSIDERED a bannable offense is crazy to me.
What if I ever play a homebrew build and some whacky combination of passives, uniques and skills deals WAY more damage, than one would expect? Might I get banned for this, just because GGG deems it to be too strong?
I have been in the community for a very long time and remember the time I discovered CoC. Back then it had no cooldown and you could just spit out as many spells as you could deal crits. It was a glorious mess of projectiles and obviously dealt absurd damage. It felt like christmas to discover this. These quirks and discoveries make the game fun to me. But honestly if I would find a skill I could use without cooldown nowadays and just trigger that bad boy 50 times a second I'd be scared I was exploiting by GGGs definition. And I don't think that is a fear a regular player should be having.

In most other games I play the line is very clear. You glitch yourself into a wall in a competitive shooter and attack people who can not see you? Clearly not intended and bannable. You find a skin that is harder to see infront of certain terrains than other skins? It's in the game and works as any other skin should. You are clearly allowed to play it, but the devs might nerf it in the future. Imagine simply picking a skin and having to worry about being banned 'cause it is harder to see. In any other game that would be madness yet in PoE we applaud when these people get banned?

I also understand, that some people were talking about intend and I see that point. The group in question knew fully well, that the combination of mechanics were not intended to yield these amounts of profits. Which is a reasonable point. But again, drawing from other games, this happens quite a bit. Frequently with the release of new content. Where new characters, weapons, factions or what have you are way too strong on release. This was a prevelant problem in LoL if memory serves. In the first week everybody was playing the new champ because they were extremely overpowered. These people (and in this instance, that included me) know that their champ is way too strong. They know it will get nerfed in the next week and they know that the devs did not intend for it to be this dominating. And that is why they play it, as long as they can.
So there is a clear intention of using something, that currently does not perform as the devs intended. Yet I would never dream of asking myself in that situation, whether or not I could get banned for that. Nor should I, if you ask me.

I do not want to start a riot here and I would love civil responses. Help me understand the ban. I get freezing the generated currency and support it. I also get why this had to get fixed asap. But why the ban? Am I the only one feeling worried about this? Maybe there is something about this, that I am not seeing. I am open for discussion and opinions.

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Pathological wrote:

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SquierHSS wrote:

I get why people are enraged but honestly this does not seem like a bannable offense to me. From what I understand all used mechanics worked as intended and there was simply an oversight concerning the combination of these mechanics. I find it kind of annoying that we, as players, have to think about which interactions (that work as intended, to be clear) might be illegal and get us banned. This is not a bug, hack or any violation of the ToS. Why is it expected that players who find a combination like that evaluate themselves how much money is an unfair amount and then act accordingly lest GGG swoops in and bans you?

I want to make very clear, that I am no money-making strategist like these people. I don't have the time to put into a league. I do my mapping, am happy when I get my 2 hours of gaming in most days and that's it. I might make 100 Div over the course of an entire league. So again, I get why people get annoyed about others making so much more money. And I too feel like what happened was extremely unfair. But that the use of working mechanics could even be CONSIDERED a bannable offense is crazy to me.
What if I ever play a homebrew build and some whacky combination of passives, uniques and skills deals WAY more damage, than one would expect? Might I get banned for this, just because GGG deems it to be too strong?
I have been in the community for a very long time and remember the time I discovered CoC. Back then it had no cooldown and you could just spit out as many spells as you could deal crits. It was a glorious mess of projectiles and obviously dealt absurd damage. It felt like christmas to discover this. These quirks and discoveries make the game fun to me. But honestly if I would find a skill I could use without cooldown nowadays and just trigger that bad boy 50 times a second I'd be scared I was exploiting by GGGs definition. And I don't think that is a fear a regular player should be having.

In most other games I play the line is very clear. You glitch yourself into a wall in a competitive shooter and attack people who can not see you? Clearly not intended and bannable. You find a skin that is harder to see infront of certain terrains than other skins? It's in the game and works as any other skin should. You are clearly allowed to play it, but the devs might nerf it in the future. Imagine simply picking a skin and having to worry about being banned 'cause it is harder to see. In any other game that would be madness yet in PoE we applaud when these people get banned?

I also understand, that some people were talking about intend and I see that point. The group in question knew fully well, that the combination of mechanics were not intended to yield these amounts of profits. Which is a reasonable point. But again, drawing from other games, this happens quite a bit. Frequently with the release of new content. Where new characters, weapons, factions or what have you are way too strong on release. This was a prevelant problem in LoL if memory serves. In the first week everybody was playing the new champ because they were extremely overpowered. These people (and in this instance, that included me) know that their champ is way too strong. They know it will get nerfed in the next week and they know that the devs did not intend for it to be this dominating. And that is why they play it, as long as they can.
So there is a clear intention of using something, that currently does not perform as the devs intended. Yet I would never dream of asking myself in that situation, whether or not I could get banned for that. Nor should I, if you ask me.

I do not want to start a riot here and I would love civil responses. Help me understand the ban. I get freezing the generated currency and support it. I also get why this had to get fixed asap. But why the ban? Am I the only one feeling worried about this? Maybe there is something about this, that I am not seeing. I am open for discussion and opinions.

Pretending anyone exploiting this system was in any way unaware that it was massively overproducing currency is either incredibly naive or incredibly disingenuous.

Nobody - nobody - who got banned for this was unaware of what they were doing.

Stop pretending otherwise.

Nothing about this situation should give ANY legitimate player ANY pause whatsoever. This was nowhere near the grey area, and anything that is would likely not get actioned at all, or simply reigned in as have so many mechanics in the past.

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roundishcap wrote:

I mean ggg banned empyrean's group in ultimatum for not completing the mechanic but infinitely spawning monsters (ultimatum monsters dropped loot at this time). So I would say it did have precedent.

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Jixa87 wrote:

Banned for their actions post the unintended game mechanics.
If you found a way to print 1000 divines/hour and spent the financial gains reasonably ie. buy a few upgrades or not spent them at all then perhaps no ban.
Same as if you wake up one day and notice you have 1 million dollars in your bank account.

But the fact that they took that generated currency and disrupted the economy buying every high priced item, all of them and flooded the market with divines is likely more the reason for the ban.
And likely the reason those who did it for a lower impact benefit did not get a ban.