From what we've seen so far, do you feel you're going to stay with PoE1 or move to PoE2?

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BaumisMagicalWorld wrote:

I can only speak for myself here, but I play PoE because it allows me to create chaos on the screen.

Awesome. PoE1 is perfect for you, then. It is an exceptional game for Creating Chaos. It is not really all that good for...frankly, most anything else. Sadly.

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BaumisMagicalWorld wrote:

And I still think that whole divided crowd pleasing is doomed to fail. One of them is gonna die, it's just a matter of which and after how long.

Why?

I don't understand why all the folks who relentlessly bag on PoE2 presume that Path the First will just up and die without so much as a whimper. Why do people assume Grinding Gear is lying about supporting and developing both games in the future, bouncing people between them as befits both need and people? Why would Grinding Gear murder their existing successful game just because they have a second one going as well?

It doesn't make any sense for them to kill Path 1 so long as Path 1 continues to make money. If it ever dies, it'll only be because it no longer makes financial sense to keep it going. Ensuring it keeps paying to run Path the First is on the PoE1 fans, not on Grinding Gear specifically.

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BaumisMagicalWorld wrote:

Games like Vampire Survivors aren't vastly popular because they offer your standard boring toolkit. 98% positive at 223.4k reviews vs 89% positive at 226.1k reviews for PoE. And one of them has dated pixel graphics and actually costs 5 bucks to play.

What's your point here? They are wildly different games, with wildly different audience. This is comparing Apples to Oranges.

Graphics matter a heck of a lot more in a ROLE PLAYING GAME vs. an old-school, bullet hell genre designed to have a nostalgic feel. Vampire Survivors is literally designed to be arcade-style....PoE is almost the literal opposite, designed to be a WORLD.

There's also far less "game" in vampire survivors for people to critique. The people looking for that type of game will find nothing better. However, there are a lot more ways that PoE can get "downvoted" simply because there is a lot more to it.

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1453R wrote:

Why?

I don't understand why all the folks who relentlessly bag on PoE2 presume that Path the First will just up and die without so much as a whimper. Why do people assume Grinding Gear is lying about supporting and developing both games in the future, bouncing people between them as befits both need and people? Why would Grinding Gear murder their existing successful game just because they have a second one going as well?

It doesn't make any sense for them to kill Path 1 so long as Path 1 continues to make money. If it ever dies, it'll only be because it no longer makes financial sense to keep it going. Ensuring it keeps paying to run Path the First is on the PoE1 fans, not on Grinding Gear specifically.

Just predicting gaming trends. Asssuming POE2 is as time demanding as the first game. Both game share similar player base, they would cannibalize each other. If people think PoE2 is better than POE1, people will move to POE2. The player population of POE1 would dwindle. GGG saying they would support and develop both games, doesn't mean equal treatment. Developers would spend much more time and resources on their more successful games. Having high player population in both doesn't seem likely.

Making successful sequel could kill their predecessor. In another word, they are direct competition. Seems normal.

Poe isn't necessarily in the best state balance wise. Feels like if I wanna be off meta(flicker) or play minions, well then im capped as far as i can take my build outside of using mirror tier gear. meanwhile some schmuck with 30 divines can make lightning strike clear ubers.

but content wise it's never been better. I can seamlessly switch from heist + ultimatum, to essences and blight to x + x using the abundance of scarabs and atlas tree tweaks. It feels so good in trade and I bet it made ssf really fun as well. My problem with poe is the best stuff is just too rare. "oh you need 2 voice jewels with 1 useless passive? farm simulacrum for a month or pay 4 mirrors" haha. and then switchin builds is very hard late league because I am sitting on 300d of gear easily but no one is around to buy my shite anymore. So funding a new build will be from scratch.

but despite all these things, poe is by far the best arpg out there. GGG has managed to make their new shiny league the best without neglecting the fact we the player base, love the variety of the legacy leagues as well(deli, ritual, ulti, etc). and no game is even close to matching poe1's content.

So regardless if i love poe2 that much or not, i most likely will keep coming back to poe 1 if they continue to innovate it as they have been doing for 11 years now.

that said, if settler's of kalgur is the starting point for poe2 and they open up the city management stuff with even more things to manage. poe 2 might top poe1 but we'll see.

:) the game isnt even out for the rest of us plebs until november.

Your presenting a false choice.

I can, and likely will, play both.

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1453R wrote:

Why do people assume Grinding Gear is lying about supporting and developing both games in the future...

Again, it's not about them "lying". I fully believe that they are intending/wanting/planning to develop both games simultaneously - in good faith. But shit happens and things change. That's the thing about the future; you can plan with the best intentions, but very rarely have full control.

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Phrazz wrote:

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1453R wrote:

Why do people assume Grinding Gear is lying about supporting and developing both games in the future...

Again, it's not about them "lying". I fully believe that they are intending/wanting/planning to develop both games simultaneously - in good faith. But shit happens and things change. That's the thing about the future; you can plan with the best intentions, but very rarely have full control.

Pretty much what he said. I already explained myself in another wall of text post somewhere, feel free to find it.

they already only have a 8 man team for poe1. im sure that wont change going forward

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ElfBoy wrote:

Your presenting a false choice.

I can, and likely will, play both.

Or you could play Minecraft. Assuming people can split their time between the separate activities. What is the size of this overlapping circle? Or are we to believe this overlapping circle is sustainably large. I believe this overlapping circle would be considerable small with extraordinary time demand of such games. Essentially there are a lot more complexities.

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BaumisMagicalWorld wrote:

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Draegnarrr wrote:

As everyone else loves bringing up Elden ring/DS

I was about to comment this. If there's a dodge roll, it needs to have i-frames. It's not gonna work without them. Especially when it has a cooldown attached to it.

I've played other ARPGs and other Souls games where they had a dodge roll but no i-frames. Can't put any names to them right now off the top of my head, but let me tell you: it sucked. You'd then either use certain skills that re-positioned you anyway, or invest into more movement speed so that you could just run out of the way. And Souls-likes without i-frames is a no-no.

What you, and many other people in this thread, fail to realize is that you cannot compare things like that in a vacuum.

Adding an i-frames dodge roll to your game can and will restrict your design space. The reason it works in souls-like games, is because the variables present in combat are very simplistic.

The way you can build your character has numerous restrictions, there is no way to double, or triple your movement/cast/attack speed. The way to scale your defences is very rudimentary, the same goes for damage output.

Going further, a large portion of your enemies' move-set is designed to be avoidable _only_ by dodge rolling out of it, irrespective of how you build/equip/play your character.

All of the above allow for the existence of a spammable i-frame roll, since most players will be in - more or less - similar space in terms of their hp/damage output.

Now imagine having that in poe where differences in characters attempting the same encounter are in fact very often counted in orders of magnitude.
How would you ever balance that?