Infernalist Caster Discusson- aka Demon Form fixes waiting room (or maybe it's already decent?)

I can only speak for the campaign. I am level 59 currently playing a Infernalist with no minions at all. Using just Fire skills from Elemental, Detonate Dead being the only none Elemental Fire skill I am using. I am running mastered darkness, so Demon Form capped. I don't have more than 4 points right now where I am at in the game. I am almost to Jamanra on Cruel, so nearly at the start of Endgame.

I have been running no minions, pure caster demon form since level 52, and it is a lot of fun. Thematically, visually, and its damage is kind of weak vs some bosses id argue, but survivability has been fine. But I am just talking pre endgame, so its not even relevant really right.

I wish I could speak for the build in Endgame currently, but I can't just yet. However I watched some Endgame T15 no minion Demon Form gamelay from someone else, and it seems fine to me. I guess ill find out.

hi,
I'd like to have ur opininin on this build i found. its a hex chaos dmg build with "perma life regen" demon form.

https://maxroll.gg/poe2/planner/0wp20l13

Ithinking in respec-ing into this one or the new lighting build u made. but i dont know which one to pick.

Updated my build's guide, linked an english guide for dual Ming's uncapped Demonform. Latest patch lets us pull levers in demon form, hooray. I also hit a bug with Second Wind on DF, but for whatever reason usocketing and resocketing the support while in Demon Form resolved it.

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TidalSnake#1420 wrote:

hi,
I'd like to have ur opininin on this build i found. its a hex chaos dmg build with "perma life regen" demon form.

https://maxroll.gg/poe2/planner/0wp20l13

Ithinking in respec-ing into this one or the new lighting build u made. but i dont know which one to pick.

I havn't personally played the Hexblast build but I've seen 3 different videos of gameplay at this point and it looks strong, very comparable to the Spark setup I'm doing but more boss damage if you start the fight at high stacks. If staying in Demonform for a whole map is a goal for you, the Hexblast max regen stuff is what you want. I'm not willing to turn my tree into "get every jewel node for more regen" quite yet lol.

ive been playing maps until t9 just casting orb flameblast and dodging from pack to pack (in demon form). its quite boring as its 2 button gameplay but its so effective, i havent found the will to switch of. full cast is like a second and goes over the whole screen, still one shots most mobs. not the most single target damage tho, its not on the level of all the one shot builds. i need like 4 casts for a rare and probably around 10-15 for a boss.

only thing i want from demon form is being able to use 2 weapon sets in demon form. not that it will happen but it would be really nice to be able to spec into an alternative form of damage either phys or cold.

but about sustaining demon form, i have 0 issue. rn i have 750 health and 4500 shield, so i can full sustain with like 27 regen from gear.

I'm also trying fire caster demon form. Demon Form seems super risky on bosses. Takes too long to ramp up and too much health flask to keep alive at my level.

I am enjoying the 'hell' out of running around incinerating everything. Although swapping to Fireball for clear is just..so much stronger.

Still, has the same problem my Bonestorm Bloodmage has. Both just simply work better spamming Detonate Dead.

Capping demon form at 10 stacks is a waste of 2 ascendency points imo as any decent weapon/shield combo will provide way more offense/defense. You basically have to try and find a way to sustain 30+ stacks of demon flame to make it worthwhile so you can quickly burn enemies down. Being forced to do your entire build just trying to sustain yourself and it's still super rippy and outclassed by something like stormweaver. It's also not fun gameplay to just spam healing potions while launching fireballs/detonate dead from a mile away in tier 7 maps or whatever.

I think a big part of the problem is fire spells are way outclassed by cold and lightning. Try this build using incinerate versus spark or comet and you will instantly notice a huge difference. Freezing enemies before they have a chance to hit you or filling an entire room with sparks is just safer and more effective. It also doesn't help that both cold/lightning have better choices with sorc, I would argue even chronomancer with fire is better than infernalist in its current iteration.

All the nodes in infernalist either work against sustaining demon flame stacks or just lead to you instantly dying when you encounter something remotely challenging, making the power exchange of these nodes worthless. This ascendency needs the most changes with bloodmage a close 2nd, making the witch bad outside of minions. Yes there are a few people making chaos or bone work with the witch but it takes a lot of gear/time to get to that point. Unfortunately because minions are so popular, GGG is probably going to let these issues fly under the radar for awhile. I shelved my infernalist for a mercenary and sorc for the time being.

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Alphavegeta#3655 wrote:

Capping demon form at 10 stacks is a waste of 2 ascendency points imo as any decent weapon/shield combo will provide way more offense/defense. You basically have to try and find a way to sustain 30+ stacks of demon flame to make it worthwhile so you can quickly burn enemies down. Being forced to do your entire build just trying to sustain yourself and it's still super rippy and outclassed by something like stormweaver. It's also not fun gameplay to just spam healing potions while launching fireballs/detonate dead from a mile away in tier 7 maps or whatever.

I think a big part of the problem is fire spells are way outclassed by cold and lightning. Try this build using incinerate versus spark or comet and you will instantly notice a huge difference. Freezing enemies before they have a chance to hit you or filling an entire room with sparks is just safer and more effective. It also doesn't help that both cold/lightning have better choices with sorc, I would argue even chronomancer with fire is better than infernalist in its current iteration.

All the nodes in infernalist either work against sustaining demon flame stacks or just lead to you instantly dying when you encounter something remotely challenging, making the power exchange of these nodes worthless. This ascendency needs the most changes with bloodmage a close 2nd, making the witch bad outside of minions. Yes there are a few people making chaos or bone work with the witch but it takes a lot of gear/time to get to that point. Unfortunately because minions are so popular, GGG is probably going to let these issues fly under the radar for awhile. I shelved my infernalist for a mercenary and sorc for the time being.

100% agree with it.

When you read some build with demon form, it looks like playable or even strong. But in any of this cases, you need the perfect gear to play it and so, you cant play it to lvl up through maps.

And Im afraid too about the popularity of minions, than GGG does nothing at all to change infernalist ascendancy for a while...

Reddit user babyCommercial216 has made me aware we that Mask of the Stitched Demon is actually usable because it benefits from the same EB/MoM conversion shit all the Stormweavers are abusing https://www.reddit.com/r/PathOfExileBuilds/comments/1hi0zqe/heads_up_for_demon_form_enthusiasts_get_to_600/

Basically, if you trade all your ES for mana with EB, and also use Mask of the Stitched Demon, it uses what your ES would have been before EB as the basis for the regen calculation. Then you use MoM and your mana as a life pool.

I'm sceptical that this is actually *good* despite the insane stacks you can build with it. Having a couple hundred HP, 2500 mana and MoM as your only defense is extremely questionable. I'd love to hear from anyone with endgame experience on it though, or if there's gameplay video out there.

Updated my build section with an example T15 map https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2331386197

im not sure you guys are right on the cap being a waste. im in t10 and i still one shot everything but rares and bosses. i watched some ice strike monk and that guy is a lot faster high health targets as i have to cast repeatedly. but i have 0 risk of dying. i die once in 20 maps maybe on a t3/4 ritual or because i stop paying attention and get crit on half shield. im also not sure a good stick/shield is that much better. at level 82 i get 6 spell levels 23% cast speed 170% magic damage. how much do you get from 2 stat sticks? i have 750 health and 4500 shield, full res and 4 jewel slots. All I need is 1 big and 1 small health regen because 750 health is only 38 points of regen. It is boring because i use 2 spells for dozens of hours. Im trying to put bonestorm on a second weapon set soon to switch to footies and try to burn bosses down faster (i need a minute for a boss and i see other build do it in like 3 seconds. im new to this type of game so im not sure what speed i should expect).

Here is my tree rn: https://maxroll.gg/poe2/passive-tree/vd9pq01y
skill gems are solar orb, flameblast and blasphemy with fire curse, health regen, mana regen. i basically dodge into a mob pack cast solar orb flame blast and then i dodge to the next mob pack. flameblast covers over half of the screen. unoptimized parts rn are having 95% fire pen (too much, 30 from support gem) and 68% shield to stun threshold (probably too much). Oh there is one caveat, i dont think you can run this without ghostwrithe cloak which puts my shield from like 850 to 4500 and allows me to regen, so yeah this is not a ssf build.

As you can see the tree has a lot of venues to improve sustain and also a lot of options to go into ice or phys for weapon sets and run a triple setup.
i will make a demo video once i hit t11 maps, i have one from t4 but i wanted to see if i slow down later.

How much stun threshold do you guys go for?

ps.: additional inefficiencies is the 40% crit recency and possibly the "35% on burning enemies node" as i have no idea on the probability to inflict burning and most shit just dies in 1 shot plus i run 0 ignite or ailment related nodes. i should check if the next boss starts burning and else maybe respec.

pps.: i havent tried to optimize my equipment or jewels at all, just using what i find. i only bought the ghostwrithe cloak.