High itemlevel shouldnt have low tier stats - More orbs aren't a good solution

Current situation: Crafting becomes more bloated because of introduction of more orbs. But we need a solution for crafting, because it's not viable.

Simple solution: Link the lowest tier that can be rolled to itemlevel instead of introducing more orbs.

Example: If an item is itemlevel 80+ and has a tier range of T1-T12, then you shouldnt be able to roll a tier of under 7 when using an orb on it.

Reasoning: T7 would still be a bad roll for end game, but at least the item wouldnt be ruined by a T1 or T2 roll and therefore would still be viable to use.

Edit: Just wanna be clear. I'm super happy with the new patch. I just think this specific topic could be adressed with the above solution, since PoE2 was meant to be easier to learn.

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AceNightfire#0980 wrote:

Current situation: Crafting becomes more bloated because of introduction of more orbs. But we need a solution for crafting, because it's not viable.

Simple solution: Link the lowest tier that can be rolled to itemlevel instead of introducing more orbs.

Example: If an item is itemlevel 80+ and has a tier range of T1-T12, then you shouldnt be able to roll a tier of under 7 when using an orb on it.

Reasoning: T7 would still be a bad roll for end game, but at least the item wouldnt be ruined by a T1 or T2 roll and therefore would still be viable to use.

Edit: Just wanna be clear. I'm super happy with the new patch. I just think this specific topic could be adressed with the above solution, since PoE2 was meant to be easier to learn.

it's a trade economy issue they're addressing. if you reduced the number of bases required that would also reduce the amount of currency required, and so without heavily nerfing their drop rate the value would diminish even quicker.

so understanding that the basic currency becomes obsolete as the quantity inevitably out scales the number of bases, the higher tier orbs will better match the supply of bases (while also lowering the avg required) and retain their respective values for long enough that we can have a functional trade economy.

it's not an elegant solution, but the new currencies along with bases being traded easier via the merchant system should accomplish exactly what we need to some extent.

i don't think they care about economy but the reddit melting down if the drops would be reduced, which would be necessary in this case

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Dak01#7115 wrote:

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AceNightfire#0980 wrote:

Current situation: Crafting becomes more bloated because of introduction of more orbs. But we need a solution for crafting, because it's not viable.

Simple solution: Link the lowest tier that can be rolled to itemlevel instead of introducing more orbs.

Example: If an item is itemlevel 80+ and has a tier range of T1-T12, then you shouldnt be able to roll a tier of under 7 when using an orb on it.

Reasoning: T7 would still be a bad roll for end game, but at least the item wouldnt be ruined by a T1 or T2 roll and therefore would still be viable to use.

Edit: Just wanna be clear. I'm super happy with the new patch. I just think this specific topic could be adressed with the above solution, since PoE2 was meant to be easier to learn.

it's a trade economy issue they're addressing. if you reduced the number of bases required that would also reduce the amount of currency required, and so without heavily nerfing their drop rate the value would diminish even quicker.

Nah, that can also be adressed easily. If you can only roll T7-T12 on an ilvl 80 body armour, then change the probabilities, so that you still need the same amount of currency to get a T12 roll on your body armour.

Example for roll probabilities (made up numbers):

Lets say these would be the current probabilities when rolling an ilvl 80 item on a stat that has a range of T1-T12:
T1 - 25%
T2 - 15%
T3 - 10%
T4 - 7%
T5 - 4%
T6 - 2%
T7 - 1%
T8 - 0.5%
T9 - 0.35%
T10 - 0.1%
T11 - 0.04%
T12 - 0.01%

You need 10000 currency on avg to get the T12 roll.

With my suggested solution, it would look like this:

T7 - 99%
T8 - 0.5%
T9 - 0.35%
T10 - 0.1%
T11 - 0.04%
T12 - 0.01%

As you can see, most of the time you will end up having a T7 roll. You still need 10000 currency on avg to get a T12 roll, but at least you will not be frustrated with T1-T6 rolls that make your item absolutely useless.

Ofc T7 is still bad, but at least the item will work on maybe not juiced maps or lower tier maps. But a T1 roll? Not useable at all.

I suggest this, because it has multiple advantages:

1. Solo play would be enhanced by this and 99% of the players play this game solo anyway.
2. It would solve the problem of having "bad luck" during campaign, because crafting would give you at least a "minimum good" result that works for what you're doing right now.
3. The number of different orbs would be reduced, making the crafting way cleaner
4. Less frustration when crafting, because the minimum result would still be at least useful.

Good proposal, I love it!

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AceNightfire#0980 wrote:

Current situation: Crafting becomes more bloated because of introduction of more orbs. But we need a solution for crafting, because it's not viable.

Simple solution: Link the lowest tier that can be rolled to itemlevel instead of introducing more orbs.

Example: If an item is itemlevel 80+ and has a tier range of T1-T12, then you shouldnt be able to roll a tier of under 7 when using an orb on it.

Reasoning: T7 would still be a bad roll for end game, but at least the item wouldnt be ruined by a T1 or T2 roll and therefore would still be viable to use.

Edit: Just wanna be clear. I'm super happy with the new patch. I just think this specific topic could be adressed with the above solution, since PoE2 was meant to be easier to learn.

The orbs split is so they can more easily help peopel to craft in campaign as they can drop low tier orbs without impacting end game economy. it doe shelp them a LOT to have tools to properly balance it.

"

Dak01#7115 wrote:

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AceNightfire#0980 wrote:

Current situation: Crafting becomes more bloated because of introduction of more orbs. But we need a solution for crafting, because it's not viable.

Simple solution: Link the lowest tier that can be rolled to itemlevel instead of introducing more orbs.

Example: If an item is itemlevel 80+ and has a tier range of T1-T12, then you shouldnt be able to roll a tier of under 7 when using an orb on it.

Reasoning: T7 would still be a bad roll for end game, but at least the item wouldnt be ruined by a T1 or T2 roll and therefore would still be viable to use.

Edit: Just wanna be clear. I'm super happy with the new patch. I just think this specific topic could be adressed with the above solution, since PoE2 was meant to be easier to learn.

it's a trade economy issue they're addressing. if you reduced the number of bases required that would also reduce the amount of currency required, and so without heavily nerfing their drop rate the value would diminish even quicker.

so understanding that the basic currency becomes obsolete as the quantity inevitably out scales the number of bases, the higher tier orbs will better match the supply of bases (while also lowering the avg required) and retain their respective values for long enough that we can have a functional trade economy.

it's not an elegant solution, but the new currencies along with bases being traded easier via the merchant system should accomplish exactly what we need to some extent.

why not just require more currency. that scales as player power increases and demands for more specific stats becomes more important

"

fr0st2k#1732 wrote:

why not just require more currency. that scales as player power increases and demands for more specific stats becomes more important

not sure what you mean exactly?

are you saying, like, widen/deepen the mod pool so there are more outcomes?

so much dev time worrying about the economy, we could have had the full game now if trade wasnt such an impossible thing to balance in a game like this.

The over optimized super speed currency farming youtube/streamer strat meta is like a hemorrhoid to developers that deal with the economic impacts of the nonsense.

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Lonnie455Rich#2087 wrote:

so much dev time worrying about the economy, we could have had the full game now if trade wasnt such an impossible thing to balance in a game like this.

The over optimized super speed currency farming youtube/streamer strat meta is like a hemorrhoid to developers that deal with the economic impacts of the nonsense.

removing scouring orbs and the ability to reroll an item is a pretty big change to their itemization system, and one they seem really committed to.

I mean, them creating that abstract layer of itemization with their currency system revolutionized the genre and scouring orbs were really at the heart of that. they made handling 1000s of ground items optional/obsolete and backloaded that mess to the player's hideout, or made it possible to conveniently trade it to someone who likes 'crafting'.

they had a perfectly amazing economic model (bit iffy lately) that they could've pruned and better maintained in PoE2 and decided against it, so it's really important they get it right under these new conditions.