Make SSF a valid alternative to Trade

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Weaver#3527 wrote:

I expect the async trade dramatically changed that. I was one of the people who hated manual trading now I'm always posting stuff on the market and looking for items.

I would be super curious to see those stats for sure.

Insofar as POE 1 and 2 really are "designed around trade", it's that GGG designs them with the assumption that trade will solve any bottom outlier randomness problems for them, meaning that they can play around with randomness in a way that would be seen as unacceptable in an SSF only ARPG. Ironically, this is a good thing for SSF. ARPGs that seek to make SSF a "viable alternative" in the sense of doing everything that trade does in-game are boring for the same reason that trade makes ARPGs boring. Non-negotiable randomness is what makes ARPGs exciting.

Thankfully, POE2 isn't actually designed around trade until crafting in the ultra-endgame. GGG has zero expectation or desire for the average player to make optimal use of trading to accelerate progression. If there was, the game would be much harder than it is. And almost nobody would play it.

The average player is in a third category between SSF and optimal-trading. This is the player who until late endgame wants to self-find all their items, because that's what's fun, but will begrudgingly shop for items when they hit progression walls or require build-enabling uniques. They also find the prospect of finding and selling big money items exciting (and now with async might actually do so), and they have none of the aversion to buying endgame items that they do pre-endgame items (though they'll probably never reach late endgame).

In general, additions that are good for that most common type of player will also be good for SSF players. This is why POE1 only got better and better for SSF until it reached the point that it's at now (the best SSF ARPG ever made), and POE2 will get there as well over time.
Until then, and you want to enjoy POE2 as much as you can, I think people might consider being more flexible with their own rules. That, or wait. GGG isn't going to start not treating trade as an RNG failsafe - and that's probably good.

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vestolevs#5239 wrote:

SSF is a challenge, not an alternative to trade..

+1. This argument comes up every league and is so pointless. Just go play trade.

In my opinion SSF experience is already pretty solid in 0.4. Pretty easy to craft 4/6 stats in most items.

-1

I don't play SSF only to not trade; I play it because it takes longer to progress. If gearing was closer to trade league in terms of ease, I wouldn't see a point in playing SSF. I think the whole point is to play the game with the trade league drop rates. A reason why I stopped playing osrs like almost a decade ago was because the devs started to design the game around making ironmen progress faster.

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vestolevs#5239 wrote:

SSF is a challenge, not an alternative to trade..

Exactly this. somehow people fail to understand this EVERY SINGLE TIME. its not meant to be an alternative to trade, its to challenge yourself

Everyone replying SSF is suppost to be a challenge while knowing fully well the only reason they can do seasonal and play this game is through trading......

make SSF have ways to gurantee farm certain uniques, rarer omens should be more common, let us have fun...

game is lacking fun at this point

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Jobama#9902 wrote:

Everyone replying SSF is suppost to be a challenge while knowing fully well the only reason they can do seasonal and play this game is through trading......

make SSF have ways to gurantee farm certain uniques, rarer omens should be more common, let us have fun...

game is lacking fun at this point

Then go play LE, where the focus is on SSF. GGGs manifesto says game and loot is balanced around a trade economy. if you want a challenge mode, or if you feel trade is too easy, SSF is for you.

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Pepega Aim7389#8174 wrote:

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vestolevs#5239 wrote:

SSF is a challenge, not an alternative to trade..

Exactly this. somehow people fail to understand this EVERY SINGLE TIME. its not meant to be an alternative to trade, its to challenge yourself

I second this.

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Pepega Aim7389#8174 wrote:

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Jobama#9902 wrote:

Everyone replying SSF is suppost to be a challenge while knowing fully well the only reason they can do seasonal and play this game is through trading......

make SSF have ways to gurantee farm certain uniques, rarer omens should be more common, let us have fun...

game is lacking fun at this point

Then go play LE, where the focus is on SSF. GGGs manifesto says game and loot is balanced around a trade economy. if you want a challenge mode, or if you feel trade is too easy, SSF is for you.

Oh, since we're talking about *manifestos*, please, read the trade manifesto.

Everything is as subject to change. It makes sense to *not* balance a no-trade mode around trade.

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SoFaux#7759 wrote:

-1

I don't play SSF only to not trade; I play it because it takes longer to progress. If gearing was closer to trade league in terms of ease, I wouldn't see a point in playing SSF. I think the whole point is to play the game with the trade league drop rates. A reason why I stopped playing osrs like almost a decade ago was because the devs started to design the game around making ironmen progress faster.

Even if they buff the drop rates x10 in SSF, it would still not be even close to trade league. Because in a trade league, 1 exalt can get you a piece of gear you'd otherwise easily spend 100-200 exalts on, and that assuming you got infinite bases to craft with. Trade leagues are a joke after they added async trade. And since GGG *will* be balancing content around ridiculous player power, it's time to start balancing SSF around SSF, not around trade.