remove trading from priority and focus thing that people actually care about:fun

Trade is nothing more than
searchable, variable priced, deterministic crafting.
Except the crafting material still exists when done.

100% result you want.

In Harvest you could fail.
On trade you only fail to search it.

"

tdonov5#2743 wrote:

removing trading fixes nothing, the core drop rate of things is still trash

im not saying everything should be handed to you, but rares/magics should drop WAY less in favor of dropping way more bases for crafting.

then people can at least make an attempt to craft instead of saving divines to buy a base and brick it immediately.

currency needs to be pumped into items - not currency pumped to get a base that you're going to brick immediately.

+1

People who defend this, and continue to baffles me

GGG has lost its core Non-chinese playerbase

All time peak was 590k for 0.1 and not a single league after has came close, With each new league we are seeing larger drops in player counts after the first few weeks

D4 averages 1.2 million monthly concurrent players, 56k players playing as I write this, and a daily average of 176k.... Their league is almost at its end too, and its still retained far more players then POE2 ever has....

All of these hardcore no lifers who keep reffering to other players experiences and saying he could do it so can you

Ok well did you know Neil Armstrong went to the moon? So clearly you can too like theres nothing stopping you its just a skill issue

Ya that sounds f**king ridiculous no more ridiculous then how you sound to everyone defending the OP

No ones opinion is irrelevant, doesn't mean their opinions aren't right or wrong, but not invalid, hence why we are sharing our thoughts and ideas to how to improve the state of the game

Oh I can do this so you can too, And I've done that, might not have been at the same speed or done in the exact way you did, But in my experience it was just incredibly frustrating, yours may not have been? RNG has a huge roll to play AS THE OP HAS SAID, WHICH I AGREE IS THE MAIN ISSUE

We aren't asking for f**king handouts, We are asking GGG to respect players time, To rework some of needlessly tedious time sinking mechanics in favor of the players time, So many different ways to achieve this, I'm not asking SSF to be buffed or improved droprates persay, We are asking GGG to prioritize fun over making everything feel like a chore....

Its too reliant on RNG and luck, All fun starts to slowly fade away after the campaign and getting into endgame, and slowly turns into a painfully tedious grind too reliant on RNG, and thats where trade should be utilized, you may get an item you have no use for but others do, Boom trade that and get what you desire, Trading is fine in its current state, the reliance on RNG is not

You could be farming abyss's all day and see 4-5 preserved parts, someone else could be doing the same as you but are just getting substantially luckier and found 20 preserved parts, Same goes for majority of other content

Enemies need a weight associated with them, Runic monsters abyss monsters, Higher the weight of monster? Higher the chance of getting say a logbook or a preserved part, to a point where it should guarantee atleast 1 solid reward when you fight a hard enough rare or a certain number etc

Theres so many ways to go about this

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

Talking about it, I'm not sure if you noticed but the game has no endgame yet, and it still gets bigger numbers than poe1 or any other arpg for that matter, and it's not even close a competition. If it can be called a competition at this point even if we don't count the side client outside of steam, consoles and whatever else

Bro where are Y O U getting Y O U R numbers from?

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

any other arpg for that matter

Diablo 4 has a monthly concurrent players base of 1.2 million

D4 is in its final stretch of its current season, It has over 56k+ Players playing it as I type this, Daily peaks of over 176k+ players, A D4 season starts out roughly around a million, after a month about 500-750k range, late into season 100-200k

Theres a reason we all say the player counts are dropping as seasons progress is because they are, not a single season has came close to season 1, Why?
All of those players got scared away

We are half way through season 4, We have an average player count of 20k, League started out at 330k...

Lets look at some statistics how about?

POE2 V
Month, MonthlyAv, Gain, Gain%, Peak
December 2025, 81,820,- 67,156,- 546.83%,299,014 (Free weekend)
January 2026, 58,579,- -22,564,- -28.40%,128,400
Last 30 Days, 52,465,- -5,936,- -10.44%,119,473

Lets now look at season 3

Month, MonthlyAv, Gain, Gain%, Peak
August 2025, 26,019,- 17,395,- 221.15%,362,667
September 2025, 124,949,96,049,- 380.22%,- 343,361 (Free weekend)
October 2025, 37,537, -84,866,- -69.96%,- 88,414
November 2025, 12,649, -24,163,- -66.30%,- 26,463

Diablo 4 V

Compare this to D4's latest season (11)
Month Players Change
Dec 2025, 1,880,496,- +283.8% (Launch of season 11)
Jan 2026, 855,280,- -54.5%
Feb 2026, 793,460,- -7.2%

D4's previous season (10)
Month Players Change
Sep 2025, 978,987,- +11.1%
Oct 2025, 771,960,- -21.1%
Nov 2025, 489,928,- -36.5%

(All of these numbers where from the website activeplayers)

So while D4 has had its up and downs, Its actually growing substantially more compared to previous seasons, and this seasons drop rate has been far lower compared to previous, the second month of D4's season 11 lost over 50% of its players, I mean ya its a new season and not all stick around, But the following month? Only lost 7% and retained the majority of players While POE2?

Its the complete opposite, It is diminishing season after season, Its only seeing the large peak player counts during free weekends and low and behold those players do not buy the game and if they do? GGG cant seem to retain them(like all my friends!!!)

At this rate majority of players only come on during new seasons, free weekends, and that majority goes elsewhere after a month, Like look at season 3's player numbers gains etc, Its a joke compared to D4

Right now endgame agency revolves around maximizing +lvl mods on items imo.

That's why half the market has ridiculous prices for those items and they are so in demand.

If they removed that mod you know how many people would start crying?

I think it should be removed and they should add better scaling for everyone's skills instead of agency surrounding this one mod. It's the best mod and endgame builds have them on multiple items. Without them the difference in damage is ridiculous.

it's literally an essential mod for items in order to do damage in endgame.

"

Jobama#9902 wrote:

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

Talking about it, I'm not sure if you noticed but the game has no endgame yet, and it still gets bigger numbers than poe1 or any other arpg for that matter, and it's not even close a competition. If it can be called a competition at this point even if we don't count the side client outside of steam, consoles and whatever else

Bro where are Y O U getting Y O U R numbers from?

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

any other arpg for that matter

Diablo 4 has a monthly concurrent players base of 1.2 million

D4 is in its final stretch of its current season, It has over 56k+ Players playing it as I type this, Daily peaks of over 176k+ players, A D4 season starts out roughly around a million, after a month about 500-750k range, late into season 100-200k

Theres a reason we all say the player counts are dropping as seasons progress is because they are, not a single season has came close to season 1, Why?
All of those players got scared away

We are half way through season 4, We have an average player count of 20k, League started out at 330k...

Lets look at some statistics how about?

POE2 V
Month, MonthlyAv, Gain, Gain%, Peak
December 2025, 81,820, 67,156, 546.83%,299,014 (Free weekend)
January 2026, 58,579, -22,564 -28.40%,128,400
Last 30 Days, 52,465, -5,936 -10.44%,119,473

Lets now look at season 3

Month, MonthlyAv, Gain, Gain%, Peak
August 2025, 26,019, 17,395, 221.15%,362,667
September 2025, 124,949,96,049, 380.22%,343,361 (Free weekend)
October 2025, 37,537, -84,866,-69.96%,88,414
November 2025, 12,649, -24,16,3-66.30%,26,463

Diablo 4 V

Compare this to D4's latest season (11)
Month Players Change
Dec 2025, 1,880,496, +283.8% (Launch of season 11)
Jan 2026, 855,280, -54.5%
Feb 2026, 793,460, -7.2%

D4's previous season (10)
Month Players Change
Sep 2025, 978,987, +11.1%
Oct 2025, 771,960, -21.1%
Nov 2025, 489,928, -36.5%

(All of these numbers where from the website activeplayers)

So while D4 has had its up and downs, Its actually growing substantially more compared to previous seasons, and this seasons drop rate has been far lower compared to previous, the second month of D4's season 11 lost over 50% of its players, I mean ya its a new season and not all stick around, But the following month? Only lost 7% and retained the majority of players While POE2?

Its the complete opposite, It is diminishing season after season, Its only seeing the large peak player counts during free weekends and low and behold those players do not buy the game and if they do? GGG cant seem to retain them(like all my friends!!!)

At this rate majority of players only come on during new seasons, free weekends, and that majority goes elsewhere after a month, Like look at season 3's player numbers gains etc, Its a joke compared to D4

I don't know if you're trolling or not. But yea...

First of all the only trustworthy data is from steam, those other websites are untrustworthy at best and clickbait or malicious at worst. There's no other official data other than steam. After seeing the numbers on steam you can extrapolate and take a fair guess how many people are playing on other platforms, but that's about it

Not to mention you didn't even understand what you sent, you're sending some monthly total for d4 and some monthly peak concurrent for poe2 lol

Look here if you want https://steamdb.info/app/2344520/charts/#max

I don't even feel like answering the rest honestly. You're comparing the hype that was EA poe2 launch with subsequent seasons, and it doesn't make any sense. There's no one in the universe that expected subsequent seasons to get more players than EA launch other than you

Regardless, as I said before, 0.3 had more players than 0.2 so the argument already falls flat there, but wanting a season to be as big as EA launch is just nonsense. Maybe and possibly the full official launch will have bigger numbers depending on how big the marketing GGG decides to do, but that's 1.0

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

I don't know if you're trolling or not. But yea...

First of all the only trustworthy data is from steam, those other websites are untrustworthy at best and clickbait or malicious at worst. There's no other official data other than steam. After seeing the numbers on steam you can extrapolate and take a fair guess how many people are playing on other platforms, but that's about it

Not to mention you didn't even understand what you sent, you're sending some monthly total for d4 and some monthly peak concurrent for poe2 lol

Look here if you want https://steamdb.info/app/2344520/charts/#max

I don't even feel like answering the rest honestly. You're comparing the hype that was EA poe2 launch with subsequent seasons, and it doesn't make any sense. There's no one in the universe that expected subsequent seasons to get more players than EA launch other than you

Regardless, as I said before, 0.3 had more players than 0.2 so the argument already falls flat there, but wanting a season to be as big as EA launch is just nonsense. Maybe and possibly the full official launch will have bigger numbers depending on how big the marketing GGG decides to do, but that's 1.0

Bro Steamcharts shows steam numbers, All other websites take all other platforms into account, D4 is at its all time peak lmfao
You have some major tunnel vision brother

POE2 is failing its core audience, and they are turning elsewhere, This game is on a steady decline while D4 was the complete opposite this season seeing its highest player after months of seeing <1 million

Your statement saying well its EA so seasons should see a fall off is no different then me saying what you disagree with, Your stuck in an echo chamber buddy, This game is losing its care playerbase, Only seeing substantial peaks during F2P weekends, and drop off rate is substantial, How does D4 seem to retain more players lmfao, POE2 is on Playstation and PC just like D4, Steamcharts show steam numbers not PS5

I know exactly what stats im posting brother xD The monthly player counts drops and retention rate, across ALL PLATFORMS And as you see, and can go see for yourself, Is seeing more and more of a fall off compared to OTHER ARPG's
POE2 Is not the largest ARPG with the largest concurrent playerbase, D4 is

Stop pulling nonsensical statements out your bum, steamcharts shows half the story lmfao, Other websites show alot more of the story and you refuse to accept those xD keep living in your bubble hun

"

Jobama#9902 wrote:

"

iHiems#0168 wrote:

I don't know if you're trolling or not. But yea...

First of all the only trustworthy data is from steam, those other websites are untrustworthy at best and clickbait or malicious at worst. There's no other official data other than steam. After seeing the numbers on steam you can extrapolate and take a fair guess how many people are playing on other platforms, but that's about it

Not to mention you didn't even understand what you sent, you're sending some monthly total for d4 and some monthly peak concurrent for poe2 lol

Look here if you want https://steamdb.info/app/2344520/charts/#max

I don't even feel like answering the rest honestly. You're comparing the hype that was EA poe2 launch with subsequent seasons, and it doesn't make any sense. There's no one in the universe that expected subsequent seasons to get more players than EA launch other than you

Regardless, as I said before, 0.3 had more players than 0.2 so the argument already falls flat there, but wanting a season to be as big as EA launch is just nonsense. Maybe and possibly the full official launch will have bigger numbers depending on how big the marketing GGG decides to do, but that's 1.0

Bro Steamcharts shows steam numbers, All other websites take all other platforms into account, D4 is at its all time peak lmfao
You have some major tunnel vision brother

POE2 is failing its core audience, and they are turning elsewhere, This game is on a steady decline while D4 was the complete opposite this season seeing its highest player after months of seeing <1 million

Your statement saying well its EA so seasons should see a fall off is no different then me saying what you disagree with, Your stuck in an echo chamber buddy, This game is losing its care playerbase, Only seeing substantial peaks during F2P weekends, and drop off rate is substantial, How does D4 seem to retain more players lmfao, POE2 is on Playstation and PC just like D4, Steamcharts show steam numbers not PS5

I know exactly what stats im posting brother xD The monthly player counts drops and retention rate, across ALL PLATFORMS And as you see, and can go see for yourself, Is seeing more and more of a fall off compared to OTHER ARPG's
POE2 Is not the largest ARPG with the largest concurrent playerbase, D4 is

Stop pulling nonsensical statements out your bum, steamcharts shows half the story lmfao, Other websites show alot more of the story and you refuse to accept those xD keep living in your bubble hun

Nevermind. This has to be ragebait

"

LewtDeezNuts#1011 wrote:

What i thought was interesting.
The temple dropped divines.
Out of the ordinary divine drops.

I say out of ordinary, but probably inline with their purpose.
When seen as a crafting material that governs the creation of items.
That many dropping is likely correct if you expect to craft something.

But it was seen as out of line and broken because of its use as a currency.

The drop rate for the temple was correct for the lack of agency the game has.
You NEED to gamble allot to attain a result.

The game is catering to use crafting material as currency and trade rather than
craft.

Oddly crafting removes currency from the game preserving its value.
Trading creates inflation as currency is moved not destroyed or converted.
Crafting deletes items from the world.

Bricked items get deleted.
Failed attempts and currency is destroyed.
Deterministic attribute purchase ... crafting materials destroyed.
Deterministic attribute purchase aka crafting bench .. crafting destroyed allot as the feature is used to accommodate new gear.

Trade destroys itself by inflation of items and currency.
Crafting and deterministic elements to spend on .. destroys crafting material.
Preserving the trade economy.

Trade is Ass.

yep: its self perpetuating machine of destruction that takes every single aspect of poe 2 and brings doom to it since ggg thinks that if trade sinks game should follow it despite years of effort put by whole team ...

"

LewtDeezNuts#1011 wrote:

Trade is nothing more than
searchable, variable priced, deterministic crafting.
Except the crafting material still exists when done.

100% result you want.

In Harvest you could fail.
On trade you only fail to search it.

it should be*

but in reality whole game is balanced and skewed to trading badly which just hurts everything around it

"

TOP_BOMJIK#4977 wrote:

but in reality whole game is balanced and skewed to trading badly which just hurts everything around it

+1
Preach it f*** da ragebaiting no lifers