Read here to help keep POE free of JSP using trash-->

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Gafgarion wrote:

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allbusiness wrote:

The owner of D2JSP regularly gives out free fg to his friends and people bot regularly and sell items on D2JSP for FG. This in effect allows botters a path to free items in Path of Exile if they really wanted to (considering how easy it is to bot in D2).



D2JSP shouldn't be allowed period. I used to use it but quickly realized that the top FG traders are all indeed botters.

Fact: D2jsp was a site founded to share botting tools for Diablo 2.

Fact: FG is given out however njagaur sees fit.

Fact: The people with 1000s of FG are not always botters. One rare item in D2 can go for around 40k FG with the right mods on it. There is a lottery that can dish out a jackpot of 5-20k every hour. However, the lottery is a huge FG sink and removes FG at roughly the same rate as people buying it or receiving it from njagaur.

My own opinions:

DUDE A is someone who uses PoE currency. They collect orbs and store as many of them as they can. When their stash fills up, the dump them on a new character.

DUDE B is someone who uses D2jsp. They collect all the orbs that they can. When their stash fills up, they go on D2jsp and create a thread and sell as many as they can for FG.

Now consider a patch release by GGG that adds new trade recipes. DUDE A spends countless hours bitching about how his 1000 regal orbs aren't worth as much and directs all of his hate to DUDE B in this thread because DUDE B didn't lose and net worth because of the patch.

People with thousands of FG are 95% of the time huge time botters. If you think otherwise you really need to take a look at their gear which would be basically impossible to find without botting heavily/duping. You seriously believe that people were finding JMODs, perfect rares, perfect Griffon Eyes, AoCs, etc. ? Give me a break.



D2JSP should be against the rules simply because you can bot in D2 to gain an ingame advantage in Path of Exile, and that's cheating, period. There are notorious botters on D2JSP that everyone KNOWS that they bot. The FBI HC clan on US West in D2 heavily bots all the time publicly and various of their members trade on D2JSP and no one bats an eye. There's too many ways to abuse D2JSP in relation to Path of Exile, and as such, it should be 100% bannable offense if you are caught using D2JSP.

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allbusiness wrote:

People with thousands of FG are 95% of the time huge time botters. If you think otherwise you really need to take a look at their gear which would be basically impossible to find without botting heavily/duping. You seriously believe that people were finding JMODs, perfect rares, perfect Griffon Eyes, AoCs, etc. ? Give me a break.

95% is your opinion. You can start with nothing and trade 1FG for an El rune and work up from there. There are a lot of people that started with nothing and never exploited the game. They simply use it as a more stable currency.

Someone earlier mentioned half of the sites the sell D2 items for cash. You can't look at the whole D2 economy and blame an entire community of people of which a small portion are one tenth of the problem.

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allbusiness wrote:

There's too many ways to abuse D2JSP in relation to Path of Exile, and as such, it should be 100% bannable offense if you are caught using D2JSP.

That's a pretty quick ban hammer. What if someone made a d2jsp account named "allbusiness" and posted in the PoE section of D2jsp.

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allbusiness wrote:

People with thousands of FG are 95% of the time huge time botters. If you think otherwise you really need to take a look at their gear which would be basically impossible to find without botting heavily/duping. You seriously believe that people were finding JMODs, perfect rares, perfect Griffon Eyes, AoCs, etc. ? Give me a break.



D2JSP should be against the rules simply because you can bot in D2 to gain an ingame advantage in Path of Exile, and that's cheating, period. There are notorious botters on D2JSP that everyone KNOWS that they bot. The FBI HC clan on US West in D2 heavily bots all the time publicly and various of their members trade on D2JSP and no one bats an eye. There's too many ways to abuse D2JSP in relation to Path of Exile, and as such, it should be 100% bannable offense if you are caught using D2JSP.

Sounds like someone's just bitter because he didn't have a perfect Griffon's or JMODs in D2 :D.

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wyldmage wrote:

We aren't going to stop people from using d2jsp.
It isn't productive to slander those who use it.

But I do think that it should be against game policy to discuss jsp (or any non-PoE currency) publicly in-game or on the forums.

That much is enforceable, and at least makes the effort to keep PoE's economy pristine.

As someone that started to use jsp recently, I agree with this. I don't want that site to become mainstream because it could ruin the economy of this game. To me, it's an alternate trade market and nothing else.

Additionally, if GGG made a statement saying "we don't want you to trade PoE items for forum gold", then I'd stop using that site altogether.

that njag guy is a very smart man.

im indifferent atm to fg use in poe cause it directly depends on the amount of jsp users that play. if low amount of jsp'ers play then fg is only valuable to that small percent of the community as a whole. thats what limits its effect on games economy.

the more and more that use it, then its starts effecting economy more by assigning different currency values to value of in game items and becomes the baseline for prices.

at the same time they somewhat regulate each other, downside is bad fg pricing vs $USD vs time to attain items. is how some fg users make profit from value differences. like forex IRL stock market. which leads to next paragraph:

ive looked at fg prices, and they are off compared to what they should be in relation to $USD. thats 1 problem i have with jsp, and there's no way to cash out (for legal concerns im guessing) whichs turns your investment into nothing in the end.

a lot of jsp'ers are paying a guy $USD real world currency for a made up fake currency they can trade through different games on his forums. i honestly dont understand the point of it other than legality concerns.

they pay a guy $USD to launder it into forum gold which they can use in his own economy instead of just using the $USD straight up and buying themselves and skipping the middle man. he's made a lot of money off a scheme that fools a lot of people.

took blizzard awhile, but they have finally figured it out. why spend millions policing a black market that isnt going to stop instead of saving the millions on top of making millions with auction house rakes. the world will soon follow.

why use another made up fake currency when $USD is ready and willing already. its a scheme that has made that guy a lot of $.

please define 'fake currency'

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dust7 wrote:

please define 'fake currency'

you seriously gonna go down the USD is fake to represent gold standard that is no longer blah blah blah stuff?

really?

you know what i mean.

maybe virtual would have been a better word, or in fantasy land game world currency. anything not publicly traded on the stock exchanges. is that better?

Here is another angle. Suppose you wanted to go to the movies. $10 would probably be what you would spent for a ticket and maybe some smuggled snacks.

Instead, you could take that $10 and give it to njag and he will give you 260 FG. I have no clue what prices are for PoE, but in D2, 260 could buy you a lot, ~10 FG per HR.

So instead of going to the movies for a few hours of fun, you can get some forum gold to allow you to trade for things that are more difficult to find in the game or that you wouldn't normally keep:

PvP gear for weird builds
LLD gear
Or just common gear that you are just too impatient to find yourself

At the end of the day, whether you buy a movie ticket, you have spent money on your own entertainment, for which all you have now are memories. (cause the ladder reset)

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Gafgarion wrote:

Here is another angle. Suppose you wanted to go to the movies. $10 would probably be what you would spent for a ticket and maybe some smuggled snacks.

Instead, you could take that $10 and give it to njag and he will give you 260 FG. I have no clue what prices are for PoE, but in D2, 260 could buy you a lot, ~10 FG per HR.

So instead of going to the movies for a few hours of fun, you can get some forum gold to allow you to trade for things that are more difficult to find in the game or that you wouldn't normally keep:

PvP gear for weird builds
LLD gear
Or just common gear that you are just too impatient to find yourself

At the end of the day, whether you buy a movie ticket, you have spent money on your own entertainment, for which all you have now are memories. (cause the ladder reset)

that logic is mostly sound. is same argument that has been used for years. the part that doesnt make sense is the FG part. thats my point.

fairly sure it roots back to get around "real world currency" for virtual items stuff. it was a legal loophole and a racket that has made him tons of money. i dont understand why you would ever use it over just using USD. thats the part that doesnt make sense to me, but he has done very well with finding people that do.

games will eventually get over it and allow it to happen. d3 is the first step, people will see what non dupe / over bot farmed items really cost and are worth.

your same logic / argument is 1 of the things that make d3 RMAH great. its an even playing field to everyone that has access to real world currency ... which happens to be everybody.

same concept, minus the middleman that shoulda never been there in the first place.

after closer inspection (out of boredom and curiosity) i understand why its used now for d2 etc.

its cause its cheap as fk lol.

you have thousands of people all undercutting each other until you are trading for pennies. which is what a HR is going for from what i see. $0.12 -.24 = 4fg-8fg.

all the while njag rakes profit with 0 inventory of a d2 shop, or wow shop, or any store for that matter, 0 sales associates , etc etc. while the thousands buying into his economy cut each others throats lol.

that man, got it goin on atm, and has for some years now.

better outlets for trading / selling will start coming in the near future after blizz breaks the ice. it will be better for all involved in the end.