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If getting to lvl 100 is not a must and does not give you any super powers, then why gate is behind a exp loss penalty ? Those who are effective at the game will reach 100 very fast anyways while those who are less effective will maybe get there in 2-3 months if they play that long in a league.
Last edited by Kodavor#1200 on Jan 3, 2025, 4:47:48 PM
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Posted byKodavor#1200on Jan 3, 2025, 4:47:28 PMOn Probation
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Like I said maybe during your time of play you're way faster than me, that's fine.
But you can't argue what I presented to you for my character which is "me", that's what the game says, that's what the math say "for me".
It's obvious that some people can do it faster than others and for them it could be 2 days instead of 5 or 3 instead of 15, that doesn't matter, the math are the same.
10% is a percentage for a reason it's not a fixed value and it means a totally different thing depending on the player. See what I'm trying to say?
You're basically both valid, but for a different target group, that is my point.
So guess what.....like any other game or even any other aspect of THIS game, it is YOU that needs to get better at the specific goal you are going for.
If leveling is your goal, and it takes you 18 hours to get 10% of a level that others can do in a fraction of the time: it means you are not GOOD at leveling.
Get better.
Do you even realize what you just described? You literally just said the game should cater to the lowest common denominator, removing all aspect of "skill". You know what that's called when a game is developed that way? A failure.
Yes....leveling quicker is a skill you must develop. Same with not dying in the first place.
Get better, on what exactly?
I'm not sure I'm following, you mean earning more xp / hour? I'm running t15 and t16s not sure what more can I do, please do point out.
Are you suggesting that I should play more than 2 hours a day?
Sorry, but my family & work is my priority not gaming so I can only spend 2 hours a day after a 10h shift at work while taking care of everything else.
And that wasn't the point of the argument at all, I've stated a lot of times that I'm ok with the xp loss, so you're way off "coming after me" at the moment. But you can do as you please.
I was explaining that for some people it is more than a week, it's a fact according to simple math.
"So guess what, get better" on understanding what you read.
Last edited by mrxkon#5764 on Jan 3, 2025, 4:54:25 PM
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Posted bymrxkon#5764on Jan 3, 2025, 4:50:12 PM
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For a game that parades around as having infinite builds. Sure do hate almost all of them at the end-game.
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Posted bymrfox123#7595on Jan 3, 2025, 4:54:25 PM
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Umm in Minecraft you can just literally go back to where you died and pick up everything. XP loss half but it's super quick to get XP back and you can easily make XP farms...
The problem with how the XP loss works in PoE2 is that it can forever stop you leveling. It isn't about it making it take longer, but potentially forever. Getting stuck and losing all progress will turn people off, especially casual players with less play time. Do you think someone will keep trying to level if they never actually make progress? One death causes them to lose days or even a weeks worth of play time?
Ho yes, in Minecraft you can eventually get a little bit of XP back and your stuff... If you ever find it in less than 15mn of a loaded chunck, if you didn't die in lava, in the void, or to mobs equiping then your gear.
And again, about casuals reaching level 100 ; why do you think casuals should be able to obtain one of the hardest and longest challenge in the game ? That wouldn't make them casuals, would it ? Or it wouldn't be an achievement anymore. It's one or the other.
XP isn't the way to progress anyways at this level of the Endgame. The Endgame isn't the place for casuals neither. They already played and completed the game, why would they casually go into the endless infinite content - and complain it's too long to complete ? If they know they are casuals, they'd stop before that.
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Posted bydwqrf#0717on Jan 3, 2025, 4:55:42 PM
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Because without XP penalty we would all be glass cannon, playing with 0 defence. We would corpse run every aspect of the game. We would be level 100 in a week. My grand mother would be level 100 in two.
The market would crash because there would be no boss service, no xp service.
I think nobody disagrees in making the content difficult and challenging. That's simply not the point here. I would LOVE to see challenging content preventing you from using glass cannon builds - and the bosses in the first three acts have been intense and challenging when the build was weak and the build mechanics too fresh to incorporate properly. But challenging content and xp loss punishment are not the same medal: XP loss is not necessary if the content is challenging.
Btw, the market would 'crash' due to missing boss service made me laugh hard.
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Posted byAngryGekko#0233on Jan 3, 2025, 4:58:01 PM
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Because without XP penalty we would all be glass cannon, playing with 0 defence. We would corpse run every aspect of the game. We would be level 100 in a week. My grand mother would be level 100 in two.
The market would crash because there would be no boss service, no xp service.
I think nobody disagrees in making the content difficult and challenging. That's simply not the point here. I would LOVE to see challenging content preventing you from using glass cannon builds - and the bosses in the first three acts have been intense and challenging when the build was weak and the build mechanics too fresh to incorporate properly. But challenging content and xp loss punishment are not the same medal: XP loss is not necessary if the content is challenging.
Btw, the market would 'crash' due to missing boss service made me laugh hard.
Only real counter to glass cannon builds is chip damage and other unavoidable damage from the boss. Which only makes it so that you need to fill out a minimum requirement to do the boss before you go back to full on glass cannon again.
Better option is to be less hysterical over glass cannon and instead look to make the more tankier builds fun as well.
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Posted bymrfox123#7595on Jan 3, 2025, 5:01:31 PM
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Just do what people are doing now if you are in trouble of dying and unsure, log out to character screen then log back in.
This instant gratification mindset is what made diablo turn to dogshite. if you dont like playing an actual game go play d4 and leave PoE alone.
Don't blame the players for using the tools given to them by the developers to avoid losing all their time investment. Pause exists so ofc everyone will use it to their advantage, it would be silly not to use it.
But anyway, these trash death penalties shouldn't even exist in a game in 2025. They're unfun,bad game design.
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Posted byToforto#2372on Jan 3, 2025, 5:05:31 PM
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these trash death penalties shouldn't even exist in a game in 2025. They're unfun,bad game design.
I wish you realized your mantra isn't actually an argument. What exactly does 2025 have to do with anything? At what point exactly does being old make something bad? How old are you exactly and when do you go bad?
They're not objectively unfun. You don't enjoy them. Some people do, but you consistently claim those people don't exist to further your narrative.
"They're bad game design" is a claim. Feel free to actually support it with an argument otherwise why should anyone take your claim seriously?
Last edited by drkekyll#1294 on Jan 3, 2025, 5:19:25 PM
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Posted bydrkekyll#1294on Jan 3, 2025, 5:18:48 PM
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You are the kind of person buying a ticket to a concert, then getting drunk at its bar, vomiting everywhere, and passing out. Then, after coming back to your senses, you ask the manager to refund be your ticket because you didn't see the concert ; and as that doesn't work, you go complain to the police that there was alcohol in the beer and that people drugged you.
Is it :
The manager's fault ?
The band's fault ?
The beer's fault ?
The police's fault ?
Or your own fault ?
Try solving this mystery.
Not. a. single. argument.
Just another toxic veteran to sabotage useful discussions.
Dang, I thought you could have solved this one. If this seems too hard for you, then why should I expect you to understand my argument ? There is like 500 pages among 10 topics over the last 10 days in the feedback forum with a whole bunch of people telling you why XP penalty exist, but I guess you can't navigate it and read, if you can't answer a simple question.
:D Yup , lots of reasons and explanations on why xp loss has its purpose and must stay. So either they completely ignore these explanations or they are blind (which might explain why they die so often and loose xp)
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Posted byMrPedez#4934on Jan 3, 2025, 5:23:49 PM
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This is not D4 where level 100 is the start, this is POE where level 100 is the END.
This is the biggest point I continue to see ignored by the same 10 people on these forums. Level 100 in PoE is NOT a given.
Getting to Level 100 takes exp. That's it.
What can you do to limit Level 100s? Take AWAY the only thing that goes towards it.
It doesn't matter at all if there are "workarounds" such as carries and cheesing lower maps. DO THAT IF YOU REALLY WANT TO!!!!!!!! Just like how people "buy" challenges. It is ridiculous, but the option is there for you if this is such a goddamn big problem.
But for the gamers who like to progress, challenge themselves, get to 100 fairly while also not choosing the boring route, the exp penalty is an essential element to the game. This gets continually written off because "its not an achievement, you can cheese it". Well I hate to break it to you....every single element of this game can be cheesed.
You can ALWAYS choose the easy route if you want to, in all challenging aspects of PoE. Don't want to make a build yourself and risk failure or lack of power? Follow a proven and researched meta build. Don't want to figure out which content drops the most loot on your own? Watch a youtube video. Don't want to worry about the exp penalty? Get carried to 100. Hell, don't want to play any part of the campaign or labs or craft or loot or "do" anything? Then buy it. Take the shortcuts.
Well if you like to challenge yourself I am all for it, just don't force others who do not want that kind of challenge into it. Seems like a reasonably good argument to make it an optional feature and sounds exactly what SSF was like before there was a SSF toggle.
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Posted byBK2710#6123on Jan 3, 2025, 5:26:00 PM
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