Why dedicate my time if I can lose all my XP with a death penalty?

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mrxkon#5764 wrote:

Get better, on what exactly?

I'm not sure I'm following, you mean earning more xp / hour? I'm running t15 and t16s not sure what more can I do, please do point out.

And that wasn't the point of the argument at all, I've stated a lot of times that I'm ok with the xp loss, so you're way off "coming after me" at the moment. But you can do as you please.

I was explaining that for some people it is more than a week, it's a fact according to simple math.

"So guess what, get better" on understanding what you read.

1) yes, i mean earning more xp / hour. run league content that offers more exp and monsters. Run specific juice designed for LEVELING. Whats the difference between someone doing t15s/16s and getting 10% of a level in 18hours vs less than 18hours? Specific planning and skill.

2) Why would you even bring this up if it wasn't the point of the argument? Your whole back and forth on this is that the exp penalty is overly punishing to folks like you who take longer to level up. Then you started going on about math...and some other nonsense. Learn how to level up faster. And learn how to not die. You brought this into the conversation for a reason. Who cares if its "fact"? You added nothing except to present a new argument against the exp penalty; one with no legs.

3) I understood everything perfectly fine, thank you. You were very clear in what you said and what you were arguing. I came after what you said because what YOU said was meaningless.

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NewAxProductions#3692 wrote:

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CaduAndrade#9284 wrote:

Why invest hours into a game to risk losing everything with one mistake? For some, penalties add excitement, but for others, they turn fun into frustration. A simple solution? Add an option to toggle penalties—offering a challenge for those seeking it and freedom for those not. Let every player enjoy the journey their way.

For now, I’ve uninstalled the game. I’ll return if GGG realizes they’re losing players for no good reason.

This isn't diablo 4 kid, level 100 in this game is actually an achievement and they should keep it that way.

I'm grinding blue t15 maps where i can sleep whilst clearing it all, nice achievement. I feel challenged by this amazing difficulty that challenges me as a player... the challenge not to engage with any hard game content so I can safely farm xp.

If you view 100 as an achievement then that is a skill issue tbh.

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BK2710#6123 wrote:

Well if you like to challenge yourself I am all for it, just don't force others who do not want that kind of challenge into it. Seems like a reasonably good argument to make it an optional feature and sounds exactly what SSF was like before there was a SSF toggle.

Lol what a clueless thing to say.....the entire game is challenging. There are challenges inherent to the BASE game, and there are additional challenges. Gearing is a challenge in the BASE game. Learning the passive tree is a challenge in the BASE game. Exp and level 100 is a challenge in the BASE game. Beating bosses that are collections of 1hkos? A challenge in the BASE game.

SSF? HC? These are extra challenges, designed to BE extra challenges. Not base game challenges. Its why the threads asking for trade to be removed are as equally stupid as these kinds of threads. Fundamental aspects of the base game are.....the game. There's a reason for all of them to exist.

And frankly even if there wasn't a reason beyond the fact that GGG wanted it in their game....that would be enough right there to keep it in the game. YOU as a player are required to adapt to what the game throws at you, or you quit. That's how all games work.

And as so many others have said, INCLUDING the ones railing against the exp penalty: it is super easy to overcome. So if it matters to you, then overcome it. Just like how you presumably beat Geonor at the end of Act 1.

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Snail__Plissken#9839 wrote:

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Toforto#2372 wrote:

+1
The least they could do is make them a toggle either in the atlas tree with extra rewards if you opt-in to these penalties. Or literally on character creation as checkboxes, but you still share the same softcore trade league economy with everyone else. Or as options in the settings menu. Anything.

I'm also never touching this game unless big changes are made to death penalties, I play Softcore, I shouldn't be punished for dying as if its in Hardcore. This is simply unacceptable.

If it was GGG's intention to chase away many players and make them quit with these death penalties, then they've accomplished exactly that.

this ain't some blizzard trash game: this is a game with actual potential and purpose behind difficulty.
if you can't handle the pressure, your loss!
wtf is wrong with this era of gaming where everyone gives up at the mininal sign of struggle or difficulty? why do people need to get an easy free ride to any content "because whaaaa whaaaaa too hard!!"?
absolutely maddening and baffling.

100% of you babies never played actual difficult games, and it shows lol

+1 spot on, left D4 after 3 weeks for these exact reasons game was too ez and there was no sense of accomplishment and i felt like everything was handed to me all the time.

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MrPedez#4934 wrote:

:D Yup , lots of reasons and explanations on why xp loss has its purpose and must stay. So either they completely ignore these explanations or they are blind (which might explain why they die so often and loose xp)

There are no reasons given, only personal attacks by a few individuals. In an earlier thread they gave reasons once and they were ousted as insufficient, ergo they do not hold up, and more than a dozen of pages later the individuals were only repeating insults and skill issue comments.

That's really all there is to it, the logic behind it is flawed and solutions exist in abundance to make everyone happy but the reality everyone knew came to light, they want to keep 100 an "achievement" gated by penalties since it is an ego thing.
Not good enough to be anywhere on a leaderboard in a pvp game so they pretend a single player game is a competitive game. You see these people everywhere.

The other faction would be people who have a vested interest in profiting from it (selling boosts) and that is, depending on what kind of service, not even allowed.

I'm closing in on 100 ever so slowly and all I can say this is the most mind numbing easy game I have ever played. If this is an achievement then maybe trying to calibrate to bronze 4 in league would be seen as impossible for a player. I wish I could spend this time doing something more fun in the game but the point of a rpg is maxing a character, it is the baseline expectation when playing one and if an obvious expectation is not met your product fails, simple.
Anyway next excuse, my achievement will not count whenever I reach it because I did not do in with melee on a naked character and uhm my gear is OP and uh I used strong skills!

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BK2710#6123 wrote:

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NewAxProductions#3692 wrote:

This isn't diablo 4 kid, level 100 in this game is actually an achievement and they should keep it that way.

I'm grinding blue t15 maps where i can sleep whilst clearing it all, nice achievement. I feel challenged by this amazing difficulty that challenges me as a player... the challenge not to engage with any hard game content so I can safely farm xp.

If you view 100 as an achievement then that is a skill issue tbh.

Aren't you one of the people complaining everyday about XP loss because you die over and over in T1-8 maps ?

How can you complain about the level 100 NOT being an achievement when you can't achieve it ?

Are you going to argue that time spent with discipline isn't challenging ?

Even when following build guides and buying gear you can't stop dying and can't focus on the goals you NEED to reach so much ?

I genuinely don't understand.

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BK2710#6123 wrote:

I'm closing in on 100 ever so slowly and all I can say this is the most mind numbing easy game I have ever played. ... I wish I could spend this time doing something more fun in the game but the point of a rpg is maxing a character, it is the baseline expectation when playing one and if an obvious expectation is not met your product fails, simple.

I'm pretty sure the point of a game is to have fun however you go about that especially in what is, at least for most people, a single player experience. If this is the most mind numbing easy game you have ever played, I'm not sure why you play it. Do something you actually enjoy...

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

Lol what a clueless thing to say.....the entire game is challenging. There are challenges inherent to the BASE game, and there are additional challenges. Gearing is a challenge in the BASE game. Learning the passive tree is a challenge in the BASE game. Exp and level 100 is a challenge in the BASE game. Beating bosses that are collections of 1hkos? A challenge in the BASE game.

SSF? HC? These are extra challenges, designed to BE extra challenges. Not base game challenges. Its why the threads asking for trade to be removed are as equally stupid as these kinds of threads. Fundamental aspects of the base game are.....the game. There's a reason for all of them to exist.

And frankly even if there wasn't a reason beyond the fact that GGG wanted it in their game....that would be enough right there to keep it in the game. YOU as a player are required to adapt to what the game throws at you, or you quit. That's how all games work.

And as so many others have said, INCLUDING the ones railing against the exp penalty: it is super easy to overcome. So if it matters to you, then overcome it. Just like how you presumably beat Geonor at the end of Act 1.

Aside from drawing a false equivalence you also appeal to authority, please at least pretend you make an argument.

The base game can be described as the campaign (and we can use it as a blueprint for the 1.0 campaign as this is clearly early access) and these "challenges" of death penalties are not present in it, the campaign which also doubles its purpose of setting expectations of later content. All the "challenges" in regards to building your character are natural expectations of the rpg genre as well. Those are not the same.

Current postgame is nothing more than copy paste of PoE1 endgame so there is something to do, as such everything in there is simply not going to stay the way it is and GGG has made that clear as well.

Yes the game has challenges in the campaign and those are not topic of discussion, what is are the additional things that happen out of the blue once you are level 70+. These are different from failing to beat bosses as they invoke different psychological reactions detrimental to player retention, the tendency called loss aversion comes into play here. It is an old design from a time of games with no content dragging out game time and was never liked anyway, but I digress.

Asking trade to be removed for example is stupid yes, you take away something some enjoy for no gain. SSF exists, or just not trade. The real issue there is of course SSF experience and how trade is perceived to be mandatory, and if not fixed will be a retention issue since majority hate trading and interacting with others in a single player game.
The same logic applies to death penalties and whatever hardcore challenges, speedruns etc exist. Those who like them should have the freedom to play with them, those who do not should be able not to. It is simple and you can cater to every group with no loss to another. Disagreeing with this is simply an ego thing of someone thinking they are better, it is like forcing people to play with legacy hotkeys in wc3 because you did it that way so they have to as well. Ego, insignificant.

It is up to GGG to find solutions to these existing problems and there are many ways to go about it, see thread history.

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

1) yes, i mean earning more xp / hour. run league content that offers more exp and monsters. Run specific juice designed for LEVELING. Whats the difference between someone doing t15s/16s and getting 10% of a level in 18hours vs less than 18hours? Specific planning and skill.

2) Why would you even bring this up if it wasn't the point of the argument? Your whole back and forth on this is that the exp penalty is overly punishing to folks like you who take longer to level up. Then you started going on about math...and some other nonsense. Learn how to level up faster. And learn how to not die. You brought this into the conversation for a reason. Who cares if its "fact"? You added nothing except to present a new argument against the exp penalty; one with no legs.

3) I understood everything perfectly fine, thank you. You were very clear in what you said and what you were arguing. I came after what you said because what YOU said was meaningless.

For your 1st point:

As I've mentioned, which is what apparently you're losing yourself completely with, I value my life outside of the game more, so if I need to take a break every 10-15 minutes for a reason ( that I don't need to explain ), that has nothing to do with skill or anything that you're trying to tell me.

That being said, I say again, you have either understood nothing, or misunderstood everything and you're trying to run your keyboard on the wrong guy at the moment. And by wrong I don't mean that you should do it to somebody else, but you're way off on what you're saying.

So here I go again, I'm a patient guy :) .

I do not have a problem with XP loss, I'm fine with it, but I do understand why some people don't want it also, unlike yourself.

I'm 91->92 on my current out of 4 total characters ( all of them in the end game ). I've beat the end game bosses also so your "get good" doesn't really apply to me, not more or less of how good GGG wanted me to be to beat their current state in EA. So currently I'm chilling in t15/t16 just running around and grabbing levels. I might've died 3-4 times since level 70, if that's ok according to your standards.

I didn't bring up the hour/XP matter, I was replying to another fellow in here and explained why it would take more than a week for some people to re-gain back that 10% just by using my current characters details, since I'm not in vacation any more and I'm back to my "normal" 10-12h/week gameplay. I personally do not care if I even lose the whole level, nor I care if I reach 100, I already beat the game as mentioned practically and I'm totally cool about it.

So you saying that "I need to farm faster" is pure nonsense my dear friend and you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I might as well be way better at farming "when I have free time" than you, you don't know that :) .

If you still don't understand that and what was the point of the post, I can't do much about it.

Again with your own supposed "smart" words "get better" and try to make sense of what you read with it's whole context.

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Edit: added some clarification about the xp/hour point.

Really all these stupid death penalties should be optional settings so players can just play however they want. The hardcore people who enjoy punishment can still choose to play with it, and the rest of the players can just play a fun game. Everyone wins.

The only reason you would be against giving players this choice is if your ego would be somehow in danger because "oh no my lvl100 achievement". Never was an achievment, never will be.

It would make sense for GGG to make them optional so that they can attract more players. You know, the whole purpose of this game. What doesn't make sense is forcing players to play with these death penalties and hardcore mechanics in softcore. This is making people quit, which is just bad for the game.

It's just a simple matter of player agency, a thing that PoE 1 is lightyears ahead in compared to PoE 2 currently.