Last Epoch is POE Killer now

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Exile009 wrote:

And keep in mind that they're all sold only on Steam, which is only half of PoE.

Nope.

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Exile009 wrote:

Err...compared to them, PoE IS totally dominant. It has always had more players than all of them (Last Epoch + Grim Dawn + Wolcen) combined. The only time it didn't was during the initial days of the Wolcen launch (and even Wolcen's launch numbers were competitive only with the Steam half of PoE, not the other half). This isn't unusual, it's the norm. People here talk about how the game is doing in terms of player count relative to itself, not those other games. That is, PoE's current player numbers are compared with its past player numbers, cos there's almost never any reason to compare it with those of any of these 'PoE killers'. None of those games come close to PoE at its peak, and even now when it's down they're far off from matching it, even together. And keep in mind that they're all sold only on Steam, which is only half of PoE.

1st off not true on other games availability.

2nd, you didnt address my point that PoE does a poor job of retention given the fact there isnt really a top competitor.

People would rather not play anything in the genre outside your league launch. That doesnt speak well for your core game, and is a dangerous way to operate.

Basically we are saying that PoE, outside its new league mechanic every 3 months (which really only sustains for a few weeks), isnt a very good game in players eyes, because they literally stop playing.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Exile009 wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

What is far more likely is that PoE will be reduced to total irrelevance.

Perhaps, but we're far from that point now. Right now all the supposed 'PoE killers' are looking closer to total irrelevance than PoE itself is. Cos even now, when it's player numbers are way down, PoE still has more players than all of those supposed 'PoE killers' combined.

But shouldn't that mean PoE should be totally dominant, given the lack of solid competition? I mean outside 2 weeks every 3 months, PoE is limping along.

What are we really talking about then? PoE performs great about 8 weeks out the year and sucks otherwise? Not exactly a ringing endorsement...

In fact that is exactly how a Free to play game tries to be. To keep playing more than the time they need to get exited and buy some cosmetics is bad business.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Exile009 wrote:

Err...compared to them, PoE IS totally dominant. It has always had more players than all of them (Last Epoch + Grim Dawn + Wolcen) combined. The only time it didn't was during the initial days of the Wolcen launch (and even Wolcen's launch numbers were competitive only with the Steam half of PoE, not the other half). This isn't unusual, it's the norm. People here talk about how the game is doing in terms of player count relative to itself, not those other games. That is, PoE's current player numbers are compared with its past player numbers, cos there's almost never any reason to compare it with those of any of these 'PoE killers'. None of those games come close to PoE at its peak, and even now when it's down they're far off from matching it, even together. And keep in mind that they're all sold only on Steam, which is only half of PoE.

1st off not true on other games availability.

2nd, you didnt address my point that PoE does a poor job of retention given the fact there isnt really a top competitor.

People would rather not play anything in the genre outside your league launch. That doesnt speak well for your core game, and is a dangerous way to operate.

Basically we are saying that PoE, outside its new league mechanic every 3 months (which really only sustains for a few weeks), isnt a very good game in players eyes, because they literally stop playing.

I don't even know what your first point is.

And PoE does exactly what it needs to for retention, since the numbers swell for every league launch. Now you're just being hypocritical - you discount long term play on D2R because that's not their business model, and yet hold league retention against PoE when that isn't their business model?! You seem to really want to view stuff in the best light for Blizzard, and the worst for GGG. To the point of literally contradicting yourself on retention.

And if people apparently would rather not play "anything in the genre", then -

1) PoE's playerbase is safe, since none of its competitors are stealing it. It'll 'die' only insofar as the genre itself dies.

2) that is more an insight into the genre as a whole than PoE, so you can't really use it to say much about PoE specifically.

3) You're completely discounting the possibility that they just got all they wanted out of the league in the first month and hence left satisfied - ready to come back fresh and hyped for the next league.

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Jerle wrote:

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Exile009 wrote:

And keep in mind that they're all sold only on Steam, which is only half of PoE.

Nope.

Que? They're sold via Steam and the Humble Store, the latter of which gives you a key to download it from Steam. Or am I missing something?

Last Epoch sucks, sorry.

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Exile009 wrote:

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Jerle wrote:

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Exile009 wrote:

And keep in mind that they're all sold only on Steam, which is only half of PoE.

Nope.

Que? They're sold via Steam and the Humble Store, the latter of which gives you a key to download it from Steam. Or am I missing something?

Last Epoch is also sold on their website and they have a standalone client. In fact, this came before they are available on steam. Exactly the same as POE.

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Jerle wrote:

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Exile009 wrote:

Que? They're sold via Steam and the Humble Store, the latter of which gives you a key to download it from Steam. Or am I missing something?

Last Epoch is also sold on their website and they have a standalone client. In fact, this came before they are available on steam. Exactly the same as POE.

I see. And is there any info on how many of their players play through standalone, or at least a rough idea of what proportion of their players do it?

Ummmm....did it die yet?

I like both games and I hope they'll be around for a long time.