Recent Economic Abuse

So, player should play a game in a way that it was designed, it is player duty to understand developer intentions. Funny. Crafting reasonable policy for such cases will be difficult, very challenging.

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feydh wrote:

So, player should play a game in a way that it was designed, it is player duty to understand developer intentions. Funny. Crafting reasonable policy for such cases will be difficult, very challenging.

It's quite simple. You can either use an exploit (that is a bug or loophole in the game, not a mechanic per se) or not. They decided to use the exploit to fk the economy for the whole player base. They should be punished.
It's that simple. You do not need telepathic capabilities to fathom this.

To heavy handed imo. While this was the most extreme case we have seen lately. We have seen some crazy "clever" use cases lately and nothing was said about it or done really.

It really seems like you just spin a wheel or throw a dart at a dart board on what will or wont get banned.

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KhelThuzad wrote:

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feydh wrote:

So, player should play a game in a way that it was designed, it is player duty to understand developer intentions. Funny. Crafting reasonable policy for such cases will be difficult, very challenging.

It's quite simple. You can either use an exploit (that is a bug or loophole in the game, not a mechanic per se) or not. They decided to use the exploit to fk the economy for the whole player base. They should be punished.
It's that simple. You do not need telepathic capabilities to fathom this.

I disagree, making the rules/policy is far from simple. Start with defining terms like "exploit", "bug", "loophole" (but not a mechanic per se) and on top of that motivation/goals of perpetrator (decision to fk economy for the whole player base). It is a mess of vagueness.

Lemme guess.... empy?

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BuyTradeSell wrote:

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HurkWurk wrote:

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_Aldheart_ wrote:

Can you explain me exactly, in which moment using Divination Scarab of Plenty on T16 scryed to T1 map you see the exploit? I agree, that was not intended, but worked within' "normal playing", unlike with Ultimatum abuse on leaving the ring or Beyond spawnlings farm. I might understand why GGG took this so seriously (especially on edge of PoE2), but in my opinion, this was same level of severity as Harbinger farm and Uniq Voidstones - just fix/nerf it, problem solved.

Hi, it appears you are misunderstanding the definition of exploit in this context. Exploiting is using unintended systems, repeatedly. An exploit does not have to involve cheating in any way to be an exploit.

Another example of an exploit is players in PvP zones that stay in safe low level areas to over-level before moving on to other content. they are exploiting the safe zone. Its an unintended way to play. but its not cheating.

too many people confuse the word exploit with cheating. exploiting is the act of using a cheat or unintended system. to be an exploit, the devs merely declare that something is not intended.

Its generally understood in games like PoE, what the expected economic reward levels are. discovering something with extremely lopsided rewards should always be reported, not exploited.

What I dont understand how this is "Unintended" this is exactly what these items were indented to do. Unintended is the six socket shields. Shields dont have more than three sockets and an item allowed them to have six unintentionally.

Every one of these mechanics was working as intended from what we were told how they would work. The results may not be intended but the mechanics were being used exactly as stated to influence the drops exactly as stated. Which part was unintended?

If GGG overlooked the tier of map when a div card drops when scrying thats an oversight on their end but working as presented on ours as the player.

Exploits shouildnt be "You have to be able to read the minds of the developer or youre in trouble" This is very clear that they didnt mean for these mechanics to have this good of a result but its only an exploit post results. Its a retroactive punishment of "Oh shoot we didnt think of that so since we didnt think this through its an "'EXPLOIT' and youre banned!"

For me an exploit has to be a mechanic not working as intended and nothing about this doing anything unintentional until after they saw the results.

Thank you, this is exactly what happens.
GGG was several times already inconsistent with their actions and interpreting the ToS. Yet, still they are devs and got full rights to punish, but plz just be fair.

Clearly, the players planned to rip the economy for personal profit. Take the wealth and let them play SSF for the remainder of the league.

I d like the idea of a gallows or heads on pikes in Kingsmarch as a reminder to others. Maybe with a mouse over sign that reads:

"Abused a mechanic to the detriment of others!"

- Lock the wealth generated so it is untradeable.
- Fix the oversight. Its not an exploit. The mechanics do what we were told they do.
- Trade Ban for a month, as punishment specifically for trading aspect of this case. As I said, its not an exploit, but the stunt they pulled with that wealth is clearly poor behavior, and would be a problem even with 'legitimately earned' wealth.

Would be fine and all if they didn't ignore the T17 abuse and more importantly, the 6 link shield nonsense last league. Everyone got off scot-free lol

I'm with the "actually test your stuff if you're gonna make big sweeping changes every patch now" crowd.

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KhelThuzad wrote:

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feydh wrote:

So, player should play a game in a way that it was designed, it is player duty to understand developer intentions. Funny. Crafting reasonable policy for such cases will be difficult, very challenging.

It's quite simple. You can either use an exploit (that is a bug or loophole in the game, not a mechanic per se) or not. They decided to use the exploit to fk the economy for the whole player base. They should be punished.
It's that simple. You do not need telepathic capabilities to fathom this.

It was not an exploit, thats the overall issue here. Players shouldnt have to be able to read devs minds. There are hundreds of YT videos on "How to make currency" so someone finding the most effective way isnt an exploit, and is the primary purpose for many players. People play for chase items and to fill their stash with currency, this is nothing new.

The mechanics worked exactly as intended, there was no bug or loophole.

+GGG reduced div cards to 4 per map.
+GGG created the scrying mechanic to change div cards to other maps
+GGG showed people the tier of maps to get drops (Something used often in crafting to limit rolls, extremely well known use of information and not loophole)
+GGG added scarabs that increase drop rates of div cards.

All these mechanics are working exactly like one would expect them to work.

Im not saying they shouldnt freeze or remove the currency gotten by this to protect the economy from an oversight and change how the mechanics do work after finding out that it allowed for some crazy interactions. But any ban for actually running the mechanics is ridiculous. These mechanics were working exactly as intended. Players shouldnt have to guess what is and isnt okay for mechanics that are working as shown.