22 recombinators.

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Skellymancer#5263 wrote:

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

Problem is.. people want recombinators to fix their own gear.. not prodeuce to put on market.. and recombinators are failing HARD at that.

Problem is.. people want TIER ZERO gear without putting any effort.

Who is this people you are referring to ? I, for one, don't aim to craft mirror-tier items with recomb, I just want an upgrade for my item. Its not always the same mods with higher tiers, it could be a lower tier but with mods that the build that I play actually use. My friends and gmates also just want an actual upgrade with their progression, not mirror-tier worthy items. You are exaggerating and being intellectually dishonest with it.

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DalaiLama#6738 wrote:

You can test this out with a good random number generator. Choose a set of 1-100. Take the top 5 numbers or the top number. Now start clicking 10 times. Do it for a long period of time and count the number of successes in 10 efforts.

You may get lucky and see success far more than 40%/10% chance, or unlucky and far less than a 40%/10% chance. If you click enough times, it will get closer to those numbers.

Whether GGG's "randomness" is random, I don't know. The game certainly seems biased to me at throwing very low tier garbage mods onto any item with 2 or more great mods. I don't make enough efforts to say that is what GGG does with their programming and servers though.

I know. I just wanted him to do the math so he realises that his "broken crafting" is not broken (in a good way).

With the 10% and 10 attempts from the OP, it would be 65% to hit it.
That's still 20 items IF he hits.
Should he miss, he has to go again. The next 5 attempts would mean he would have an overall chance of 80%. That's 30 items in total. For one item with 2 mods.

With the 5% and 10 attempts, it would be 40% to hit. So already in the range of "less likely". The 15 attempts would be a coin flip. And 30 attempts, 60 items used, for the 80%. The result? An item with 2 mods.

With the 1% odds and 10 attempts? Oh boy. Not even 10% to hit in the tries. For a coin flip, he needs 70 attempts, and for 80% probability to hit!? 160 attempts. That would mean 320 items + the Expedition currency.
Still... for a weapon with TWO mods...

Imagine thinking "just get 320 items and the needed recomb currency for your 2 mods item" is good crafting.
It's just a slot machine with extra steps.

And like you said... who knows how Jonathan (he did the math for recomb) implemented the "randomness" actually.

Getting "lucky/unlucky" is... in reality... a thing, so... Good Luck.

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Septile#3881 wrote:

[
You can just toss some whetstones on the highest tier base available to you during campaign and throw currency at it and 99999/100000 it will be a better item than whatever you're using.
It's really not that difficult.

When the discussion degrades to the point of "Why should we care about item drops being meaningful anyway" then that is how you know you have simply lost the plot.

Except this is FALSE> I have done with with both my characters in this league aalways that I could. Not a SINGLE TIME. not a single time I exchanged the weapon I had for a weapon I crafted. Gambling for blind items and buying ready from vendor were ALWAYS the source of my upgrades. Crafting NEVER EVER in POE2 gave me a better item than I had except on the first 5-6 levels when any regal on a random magic item is a true upgrade.

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Varn76#2904 wrote:

This is clearly not what we're talking about. There is "putting effort" and "having to gather hundreds of base item to hit the mod you're chasing with essences"

It is time consuming, I admit.
And you indeed have to invest into serious number of attempts.

But this is the kind of determination you need to get a mirror worth item anyway...

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bewilder2#0356 wrote:

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Skellymancer#5263 wrote:

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

Problem is.. people want recombinators to fix their own gear.. not prodeuce to put on market.. and recombinators are failing HARD at that.

Problem is.. people want TIER ZERO gear without putting any effort.

Who is this people you are referring to ? I, for one, don't aim to craft mirror-tier items with recomb, I just want an upgrade for my item. Its not always the same mods with higher tiers, it could be a lower tier but with mods that the build that I play actually use. My friends and gmates also just want an actual upgrade with their progression, not mirror-tier worthy items. You are exaggerating and being intellectually dishonest with it.

There has never been a point in the entirety of my playtime where I didn't have at least small upgrades available to me. So when you claim this, you and your friends either don't know how to actually get upgraded gear, or he is right and you want an item editor to give yourself mirror tier gear. Given that everybody is pointing to PoE 1 or LE as the standard for crafting systems, it pretty clearly shows that people want the item editor.

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

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Septile#3881 wrote:

[
You can just toss some whetstones on the highest tier base available to you during campaign and throw currency at it and 99999/100000 it will be a better item than whatever you're using.
It's really not that difficult.

When the discussion degrades to the point of "Why should we care about item drops being meaningful anyway" then that is how you know you have simply lost the plot.

Except this is FALSE> I have done with with both my characters in this league aalways that I could. Not a SINGLE TIME. not a single time I exchanged the weapon I had for a weapon I crafted. Gambling for blind items and buying ready from vendor were ALWAYS the source of my upgrades. Crafting NEVER EVER in POE2 gave me a better item than I had except on the first 5-6 levels when any regal on a random magic item is a true upgrade.

I've done it successfully multiple times on every single character I've made for PoE 2.

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bewilder2#0356 wrote:

Who is this people you are referring to ? I, for one, don't aim to craft mirror-tier items with recomb, I just want an upgrade for my item. Its not always the same mods with higher tiers, it could be a lower tier but with mods that the build that I play actually use. My friends and gmates also just want an actual upgrade with their progression, not mirror-tier worthy items. You are exaggerating and being intellectually dishonest with it.

Well, you may want "an upgrade", but this is not how recombination works.

I will simplify it a bit, so you can get it:

Recombining 20 level gear with low mods, and recombining 75 gear with top mods, costs approximately the same.

It makes absolutely no sense to invest the time to recombine non-perfect rolls, because the gear itself can be bought for next to nothing.

And to make matter worse - the chances for top tier rolls, compared to the mid-tiers are not proportional to the prices of those items.

It would be much better to simply buy your mid-tier upgrade. And sell your currency, than waste it on such effort.

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Skellymancer#5263 wrote:

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bewilder2#0356 wrote:

Who is this people you are referring to ? I, for one, don't aim to craft mirror-tier items with recomb, I just want an upgrade for my item. Its not always the same mods with higher tiers, it could be a lower tier but with mods that the build that I play actually use. My friends and gmates also just want an actual upgrade with their progression, not mirror-tier worthy items. You are exaggerating and being intellectually dishonest with it.

Well, you may want "an upgrade", but this is not how recombination works.

I will simplify it a bit, so you can get it:

Recombining 20 level gear with low mods, and recombining 75 gear with top mods, costs approximately the same.

It makes absolutely no sense to invest the time to recombine non-perfect rolls, because the gear itself can be bought for next to nothing.

And to make matter worse - the chances for top tier rolls, compared to the mid-tiers are not proportional to the prices of those items.

It would be much better to simply buy your mid-tier upgrade. And sell your currency, than waste it on such effort.

And that is among the things that need to change. Level 20 gear should be almost free to recombinate.

Any craftign that is only usable at end game is WASTED mechanic for msot players tht do nto even play endgame.

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When the discussion degrades to the point of "Why should we care about item drops being meaningful anyway" then that is how you know you have simply lost the plot.

Explain then. I'm actually seriously tired of ppl swatting that argument like it's something obvious. Useless drops have been part of every single ARPG since D2 as I said above. Why suddenly did it became a problem to be solved whatever the cost ? Especially if the cost is crappy crafting ?

Saying that POE1 crafting system is basically "item editor" is such a overstatement it's bordeline disrespectful. Do you know what portion of the playerbase in POE1 actually beaten an uber pinnacle ?

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Septile#3881 wrote:

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bewilder2#0356 wrote:

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Skellymancer#5263 wrote:

Problem is.. people want TIER ZERO gear without putting any effort.

Who is this people you are referring to ? I, for one, don't aim to craft mirror-tier items with recomb, I just want an upgrade for my item. Its not always the same mods with higher tiers, it could be a lower tier but with mods that the build that I play actually use. My friends and gmates also just want an actual upgrade with their progression, not mirror-tier worthy items. You are exaggerating and being intellectually dishonest with it.

There has never been a point in the entirety of my playtime where I didn't have at least small upgrades available to me. So when you claim this, you and your friends either don't know how to actually get upgraded gear, or he is right and you want an item editor to give yourself mirror tier gear. Given that everybody is pointing to PoE 1 or LE as the standard for crafting systems, it pretty clearly shows that people want the item editor.

Do you think having a double T7 flat damage on ring, with 2 resistances in suffix at least 25%, and another beneficial prefix or suffix, is mirror-tier worthy ?

Does trying to get 30% movement speed boots with decent ES roll or life roll like T6 with double resistances at 25% or a 30% ele resist + 20%ish chaos resist is a mirror-tier worth item ?

Does trying to replace my current ring that have double flat T7 damage with suffixes that I dont need, with a ring that has similar 2 flat damage roll tiers but with at least 27-30 str + int , a mirror-tier worth item ?

Does trying get an upgrade for this :



My current actual ring , with similar mods minus Light radius and/or replacing the rarity with any flat damage mod with at least tier 3 to 5, is a mirror-tier item ?

Who kind of people and what kind of items that both of you and skelly referring to ?

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

Except this is FALSE> I have done with with both my characters in this league aalways that I could. Not a SINGLE TIME. not a single time I exchanged the weapon I had for a weapon I crafted. Gambling for blind items and buying ready from vendor were ALWAYS the source of my upgrades. Crafting NEVER EVER in POE2 gave me a better item than I had except on the first 5-6 levels when any regal on a random magic item is a true upgrade.

Brother.

Open the damn trade site.
Select any sort of weapon - bow, crossbow, staff, mace - whatever.
Sort it by DPS and see how much the top 100 weapons cost.

You want to max your build and waste those hundreds of divines - go ahead.

I do not give a damn what you do with your divines, did you bought them with real currency or whatever.

But for me, being able to get one of those, for my build, without having to pray to satan for a mirror drop?

That is a step in the right direction.