Vaal skills are basically a giant noob trap.

Why does everyone assume Vaal skills can't be used normally? Maybe they function just like normal skills, but once the charge is up they do the boosted effect. Even if not, that Vaal arc gem in the video doesn't take that many enemies before its available again.

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Veta321 wrote:

However, I would apprehend that these concerns did not cross the collective minds of GGG.

You need to look that word up...and rewrite that entire sentence.

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Telzen wrote:

Why does everyone assume Vaal skills can't be used normally? Maybe they function just like normal skills, but once the charge is up they do the boosted effect. Even if not, that Vaal arc gem in the video doesn't take that many enemies before its available again.

because that's not an assumption

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Yxalitis wrote:

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Veta321 wrote:

However, I would apprehend that these concerns did not cross the collective minds of GGG.

You need to look that word up...and rewrite that entire sentence.

How smug and presumptuous. Maybe you should?
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/apprehend

"

b : to anticipate especially with anxiety, dread, or fear

1.
arrest (someone) for a crime.
"a warrant was issued but he has not been apprehended"
synonyms: arrest, catch, capture, seize; More


2.
understand or perceive.
"great art invites us to apprehend beauty"

what a silly word

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I think most people have seen the video displaying a chunk of the Vaal Skills. At first glance, they look great. However, they are basically the most glorified noob trap in existence.

Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion.

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Almost every build in PoE is designed to slaughter groups of foes (like any other PvE scenario in any game.) 99% of people's 6 links will be used as the "group" skill. Now, why would you choose to take up another set of slots to run a Vaal Skill (glorified AoE) that you can only use every X kills when your primary 6l already does a fine job of that? You are coughing up more Auras, a single target skill, and/or CwDT slots to be redundant.

I find it hard to reason like this, considering that we still know basically nothing about the skill details, dynamic and usage in actual gameplay. Once we have actually made some serious testing, this type of critizism would be viable.

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The solution is to run your 6l for single target damage then, right?
Hardly. You'd spent more time individually killing foes to charge your AoE attack than it would take you to just use AoE and mow them down in the first place.

So you just run the Vaal skills on a weapon swap!
Nope. I can almost guarantee the gem will need to be "active" to be charged. Auras deactivate. CwDT becomes null. It just follows suit. Plus it would be a no-brainer/mandatory.

Furthermore, Vaal Skills scale negatively with party size.
You have to get the final blow to charge the Gem. But Terror, how can you possibly know that?
1. It's the way potions work.
2. Do you really think GGG is going to let players run around alternating Vaal Skills off of each other? That would be broken. Don't be silly.

Some people will run them and claim they are just fine.
Those people would probably have a better build if they just ran Auras or CwDT in it's place.

Yet again, you are assuming way too much, considering how little we know about the usages of these skillgems. If anything, looking at how they have managed so far with radical changes, one would assume that GGG has had a good idea, tested it out and actually made a good call letting it through, even tho it might not seem like it at the first glance.

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Alas, there are a few exceptions that would make Vaal skills efficiently usable.
1. Vaal Skills that gain largely increased single target damage. These are to be used on the occasional rares that pop up. The Ice Nova might be an example of an AoE that scales single target damage, but I doubt the damage scales hard enough to really override just using a single target based 4l instead. Corpse Explosion might be another, assuming it still runs off a percent (which would mean it takes a single Gem Slot to use effectively.)

2. Running one gem of a 6l as a Vaal Skill "support" to double up on actual support gems. Lose some effective overall for a large burst occasionally.

3. Those super rare builds that really don't have shit to use. Like Righteous Fire.

4. The rare possibility of running only Vaal Skills and having them charge each other. Likely not efficient. Also screwed if the chain breaks.

5. Skills that are mechanically superior enough to avoid requirements like support gems (like Corpse Explosion's inherent need to not really need supports.)

Yet again I feel like you are putting the current build of the game as a rock solid metagame that will never change. Lets for a minute assume that what we know as viable builds now will be long gone in 3 weeks, and that the changes to the passive skilltree, new skills etc actually will make some drastical changes? Maybe the game will feel better, more dynamic, and lets us try out new exciting builds?
Now that is a thought.

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Basically, only Vaal Skills that are able to focus a lot of damage onto a single target will get used commonly. Few niche builds may find use for others. Oh and just a reminder, this isn't about rather or not the gems will be usable. It's about rather or not they are more efficient/effective than simply using what we've had this whole time.

I just want to say that you might be right on this whole post, that this will actually just be a glorified noob trap for showz, but I feel like you are assuming way to much about how the game will turn out in the new leagues, and therefor cannot agree with you.

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Veta321 wrote:

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Telzen wrote:

Why does everyone assume Vaal skills can't be used normally? Maybe they function just like normal skills, but once the charge is up they do the boosted effect. Even if not, that Vaal arc gem in the video doesn't take that many enemies before its available again.

because that's not an assumption

I've yet to see a dev say it, you got a quote?

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Telzen wrote:

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Veta321 wrote:

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Telzen wrote:

Why does everyone assume Vaal skills can't be used normally? Maybe they function just like normal skills, but once the charge is up they do the boosted effect. Even if not, that Vaal arc gem in the video doesn't take that many enemies before its available again.

because that's not an assumption

I've yet to see a dev say it, you got a quote?

there was some video showcasing vaal skills in action.

http://www.twitch.tv/gamespot/b/506356011?t=31m50s

"players can use these every few minutes to punctuate the combat"

To reiterate, I can't imagine they're intended to be supported by multiple gems.

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Nephalim wrote:

there was some video showcasing vaal skills in action.

Yeah I've seen it, and there were two versions of each skill, but that could just be so they didn't have to sit and build the charges up to show them off. And even if they are separate, like I said the things seem to build up pretty quick.