i'm giving up - DEVELOPERS PLEASE READ!

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dwqrf#0717 wrote:

First, we have to remember the crafting on PoE1 was also mainly about gems slots and colors, which was more a RNG currency spam than anything. As the skill gem system is not relative to the gear anymore, gear crafting is only about affixes upon the right base in PoE2 ; which does change a lot of the value of orbs invested in.

Secondly, while the alteration orb is missing, the reforging 3to1 makes up a good way to rerolls bases and have a endless stream of free blue items to augment as long as you pick up the bases for your character. It doesn't take more than a single stash tab to have a constant rolling on gear (1-2 pieces, as 3 makes it go back to 1).

Then, the currency rarity switch of exalted orbs and the easily obtainable regal shard through shards allows transforming up the blue bases into some potentially better items.

When you consider those rarity and orb usage, and with a currency market of 1 divine for 300 exalted (not there yet), drop 1 single divine in your playthrough and you can make good blue bases with two augmented good/perfect affixes into a 100x 6 affixes rares item for your character (because you can only use up to 3 exalted orbs per regaled item)

You have at least two rolls of your choice, then regal + 1x exalt can give you a hint about how worth it it is to continue slamming, and if it's two bad rolls from it and you are rich enough, you can chaos upon for 50/50 chance of removing one of the bad mods.

Slamming further exalted orbs into a good base with 2-4 good mods isn't that much of an investment in PoE2, and can lead to some nice surprise, or else, it can be marketed away or reforged into a endless pile of rares.

As a baseline for crafting, without considering the rarer determinitic options and while also knowing more tools are going to be implemented into the future, I honesty can say the crafting so far has been fun for me ; yes, heavily random, but much more accessible due to both the reforging process and the more lootable and therefor usable exalted orbs.

The problem with people hating the crafting on PoE2 is that they don't pick up white and blue bases to augment/regal/exalt, because, as a Softcore crowd, they'd rather use those precious exalted orbs as a money to trade instead of trying themselves to use it ; which isn't a problem SSF players encounter. Also, RNG is sure random, but the negative cognitive bias of only ending up having bad items is not an objective reality. You just gotta do it, it sure takes some time and currency, but it's not out of reach when you swim in it.

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

1) that's just not true... While sockets and colors were a part of crafting, it is not correct to say that has any effect on the creating focus of mod rolling at all.

2) more tedious for no reason. Plus your math is wrong... You can't ever "sustain" 3 to 1 indefinitely within a stash. The output is 66% less than the input. Also ... This isn't crafting. Also....3 to 1 vendor recipe has always existed in PoE 1 too. Why wasn't it used? Because it wasn't crafting.

All the rest again shows LESS crafting and more dice rolling than ever before, even beta PoE 1. The existence of eternal orbs is quite literally what made "crafting" exist. Without the ability to exert control at some point, it remains nothing more than gambling. Just like trying to find a raw item with perfect rolls

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dwqrf#0717 wrote:

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McHuberts#7978 wrote:

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dwqrf#0717 wrote:

In PoE2 you have to think how to play, what to pick up, and how to craft ; and a invest a little time, effort, attention and patience, for well deserved rewards. I know that's hard and exhausting, but that's how it is.

Think how to play?
Yeah, learn how to dodge roll and how to copy a OP-build. The game is too boring and slow to experiment with builds yourself.

What to pick up?
You can leave almost everything on the ground unless you want a lot of regal orbs.

Craft?
Why do you call gambling crafting? Is that what you do when you go to a casino? "Honey, I go crafting this weekend. I probably will loose!"

A little time?
Hundreds of hours invested that brought some fun and excitement in the first stages, but more frustration and disappointment when it became clear what this game was really about. RNG and trade.

Effort, attention and patience?
There are limits to what players like in terms of effort, attention and patience. Are the rewards in balance with these aspects. I do not think so. The balance is way off.

Yup, you don't get it, at all.

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dwqrf#0717 wrote:

1) the lack of gem sockets, socket color, orbs of fusing, jewelers orbs, and chromatic orbs means you have much less to worry and to gamble to transform an item into a better item. If you have a blank six link, you may brick it when looking for stats but it's still a 6 link ; when you have a good items but no gem slots/links, it may eat so much currencies until you make it a 6 link, and that's all a part if crafting.
In PoE2, you just look at the base
the affixes and the rolls. So not only you get more valuable orbs, , more potential good items, but you also get less variety of orbs for the old multilayers crafting. It's much more accessible. Does that mean they balanced it to make it harder to get the rolls you want as you have less crafting to do ? Well, actually, not really. So you have more usable bases, and more currencies.

2) What ???

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

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dwqrf#0717 wrote:

1) the lack of gem sockets, socket color, orbs of fusing, jewelers orbs, and chromatic orbs means you have much less to worry and to gamble to transform an item into a better item. If you have a blank six link, you may brick it when looking for stats but it's still a 6 link ; when you have a good items but no gem slots/links, it may eat so much currencies until you make it a 6 link, and that's all a part if crafting.
In PoE2, you just look at the base
the affixes and the rolls. So not only you get more valuable orbs, , more potential good items, but you also get less variety of orbs for the old multilayers crafting. It's much more accessible. Does that mean they balanced it to make it harder to get the rolls you want as you have less crafting to do ? Well, actually, not really. So you have more usable bases, and more currencies.

2) What ???

Disagree with your rationale on #1. PoE 1, even with the colors and links, was exactly the same: all about the base item. Only thing PoE 2 does is remove the step of rolling sockets, links, and colors. Whatever the cost may have been to do that to the base is irrelevant, because currency overall is more rare in PoE 2 already. You can't begin to compare the "cost" of one vs. the other, so many factors of gameplay render that near-impossible.

My second point is that the 3-to-1 exists and has existed in PoE 1 for a decade. You sell three rare items of the same base to a vendor, you get one rare item (rerolled) of the same base type back. This isn't a "new" crafting thing. And it isn't crafting in PoE 2 either, just as vendor recipes weren't really "crafting" in PoE 1.
Also, you said and I quote:
"It doesn't take more than a single stash tab to have a constant rolling on gear (1-2 pieces, as 3 makes it go back to 1)."

This is factually incorrect and mathematically impossible. When 3 becomes 1, you are constantly losing 66% of your input (2 out of 3 items). That is not indefinitely sustaining as you describe in that quote. And how is this "better" than simply having a scouring orb or alteration orb? Both existed in PoE 1 and clearly one was wildly more preferred to the point of people not even knowing the other method existed.



And the overall point is still that the entire process, from the beginning of an item, to the end of "crafting" that item in PoE 2......is WORSE than the most basic, initial eternal/exalt crafting system found in PoE 1. It was still mostly gambling in PoE 1 with that system, but at least you got to "reset" your item and not just straight up constantly lose them. They recognized, even in 2012, that FULL gambling at every step of the process isn't crafting. Nor is it a sustainable system to have.