free unlimited respec on passive skill (or a sandboxed Free Unlimited Respecs League)

I'm all for giving people what they want. However, PoE needs to be able to differentiate itself from other titles as well.

People will leave a game they don't feel they can properly invest into their characters. While the majority of beta players may want it to be more hardcore with its unforgiving respec system, it won't help GGG garner new players. There is nothing more frustrating then finding out the guy you spent dozens of hours on is a complete gimp. People will leave if they mess up their spec rather than spend days trying to build another guy or grinding orbs to fix it.

Unless GGG is going for the strictly hardcore crowd, they need to implement a kind of respec system, the lack of is far too polarizing nowadays to do without.

What you don't seem to understand is that for PoE to be really succesful it has to differentiate itself from the mainstream production in not doing the same thing.
and guess what's it ?
free respec in every f'g games out today!!
there's not anymore a sense of creating and constructing of your character.
this was the last thing which stayed from the RP (Role Play issued from the tabletop convivial things... remember?). no what we get in every RPG?

a blank page... a bland clone with no sense of reality, more and more virtual as are games "evolving".

the only thing that let you want to play a RPG for long (and not swap games as you are able to swap your skills...) is the feeling of possessing a "Real" and "permanent" character.

try to think to that for a second...

"

Ultreos wrote:

The lack of a regular enough free respec system is what makes me not like this game as much.

In Diablo 2 you got one full respec per difficulty, and you could earn a full respec killing the bosses on the hardest difficulty and getting a semi rare drop.

People who dislike the idea of a full respec are generally of an elitist attitude and believe it will keep noobs and softcores out of their game.

I'm no noob or softcore player, I can play games for hundreds of hours. Being forced to replay at a lower level regardless of how much fun I had the first time, is not fun when I know I have a higher level character.

I set my tree off by 20 points listening to people claiming how badass all fire damage build was. Being less then effective as a barbarian against half the enemies in the game is not a badass build.

I stopped playing and corrected it during a skill tree wipe that happens in the Beta. I don't imagine I am the only one who does this.

A game where you're players are stopping play because of an unfun aspect of the game is not a game that can survive in the long run. There are only so many elite players in any game that can keep a game going without people who want this kind of feature, you lose a lot of players.

I dig this game, I like it, I may come back to it if I get bored of D3, and then again I might not. And if I didn't it would be for this one feature.

It's one thing to not like a feature of a game and I will still play it, then to have a feature that makes me stop playing the game. If you have a feature that makes players stop playing, your system is broken.

I quoted the whole post because I completely agree with this.

But then... if the 13000 people who bought the game are happy with this...

What's sadden me is that this fanbase may kill the game. Who really want to play a game when you screwed your first character?

You have 2 choices at this point:
- ho the game is cool, I want to do another character with different stats
- well too bad, I screwed my character, the game is fine, but I may want to play something else now...


About free respec in every games in the market... I guess the deciding factor is somewhere else now (take a look at D3 or GW2... it's called gameplay)

"

kodr wrote:

I quoted the whole post because I completely agree with this.

But then... if the 13000 people who bought the game are happy with this...

What's sadden me is that this fanbase may kill the game. Who really want to play a game when you screwed your first character?

You have 2 choices at this point:
- ho the game is cool, I want to do another character with different stats
- well too bad, I screwed my character, the game is fine, but I may want to play something else now...


About free respec in every games in the market... I guess the deciding factor is somewhere else now (take a look at D3 or GW2... it's called gameplay)

Lol. Are you troling man? If the game has good gamplay you will play it no metter if you fucked up your build or not. If you are bored playing the game, free resect will not help you. Look att d3 for gamplay that comes form free respect? Lol, thats one of the reasons youl get bored with the game if you can swap skills when ever you want. This is a RPG game. This is not god of war where you use all skill, but create you character, that is not different only by items he has.

In D2, they implemented the respec after ~10 years living without it, after more and more increasing complaints from dumber and aumber people, people not (longer) willing to sacrifice anything to have some kind of success...

In a game like this, you have to spend lots of time to compete with the top! Or how many people should quit (D2) for not being able to play ~24 hours a day after ladder reset?!

I'm one of the "late adopters" of D2, starting around the 1.10 patch, in a situation where most of the information about the game have been already available in the net, and I screwed lots of chars and builds over the years, to find how things work, to find out whats good, and also to find out what fits my playstyle... the only thing it really needs, is an option to prevent missclicks in the map while moving around.
And the very best addition would be a combination of a display of changes in your stats, with a final confirmation on tree leaving: so that you could play with your tree, and simulate the next step(s).

Every step beyond this, gives the player(s) an advantage against the game, by the chance to adapt the tree layout for different situations (like switching between resistences) - the more and the easier the respecs become, the more switches are possible and the greater the advantage.
Even if we only observe the time to make a new char, this also is an advantage against other players too, no "need" to sell such things...

As I always say, the goal for games IS to CONSUME time, as much as possible... if you can not afford this, dont play this kind of complex games - and dont try to demand things that 'ruin' the fun of others...


...in games like this, there is nothing more boring as to have a perfect char with no goal left to do, IMHO.

Really, I can't imagine how someone could 'break' their character by mistake. Sure, maybe you now realize that you wanted a passive armour bonus rather than a mana regen bonus, but the game is still fun, and you can still do all the things you enjoy.

If you want to explore a vastly different type of character, most of the playstyles are available within minutes of starting a new character (just find the weapon you want, then the armour, etc.), and there you are.

Plus levelling is fast in this game.

This whole "screwed up your build" thing isn't even a relevant argument. You can usually just put your passives anywhere randomly and play through most of the game. Anyone who puts a slight bit of thought and common sense into his passive allocation will do just fine.

The only real way to make a useless build is to select a poor choice of keystone(s). They all clearly state what they do, so a poor choice isn't the game's fault. If you're unsure, a quick search on the forum will give detailed explanations on keystone mechanics and synergies.

There is a huge difference between a useless build and a less-than-optimal build. Placing 10 points into mace passives then deciding to use axes is the player's decision. He could continue using an axe with some ineffective passives, he could use Orbs of Regret to change his tree, or he could start a new character. A witch changing from fire to ice has the same options.

The game is meant to be challenging. Giving players the ability to try whatever they want to find the best way to beat the game isn't challenging. It's nearly cheating in my opinion.

It’s not enough simply to be different for the sake of it. The difference need to be fun and/or actually improve some problem from the other system, while hopefully not creating a new, worse problem.

Also when people talk about screwing up their build I don’t think they just mean managing to make a character that is stupidly difficult or imposable to get through the game with. It can also mean ending up with a style of play you don’t like using.

A few ways to screw your build:
- taking Blood Magic too early
- Iron Reflexes on a melee duelist with hybrid armor
- take the crit nodes in the duelist area, thinking you'll get 100% crit (every noobs do that, you can search a few posts about that)

But in the end, it's not that important, like WhiteBoy88 said. What the fuss about no-respec if it isn't that important then?

"

kodr wrote:

A few ways to screw your build:
- taking Blood Magic too early
- Iron Reflexes on a melee duelist with hybrid armor
- take the crit nodes in the duelist area, thinking you'll get 100% crit (every noobs do that, you can search a few posts about that)

But in the end, it's not that important, like WhiteBoy88 said. What the fuss about no-respec if it isn't that important then?

Do orbs of regret not work on keystones? o_O

I haven't actually opted for any of them yet.