Listening to the community too much is what ruined PoE 1 for many of us.

power creep really hurt poe1 over the years but players running through content imho was just the symtom, the reason they were enabled to do so was the transparency ggg implemented into the game.

two examples:

1) their decision to show all item properties on pressing "alt" killed all the expert knowledge about how hybrid affixes interacted with single affixes, it took all the magic off itemisation.


2) the release of "path of building" killed build making by trivialising it and making it a simple hunt for more higher numbers rather than interesting skill combinations. it took all the magic away from making builds.
as a result, players asked for more damage rather than interesting skill interactions.

also it enabled the sharing of overpowered builds to the whole community in minutes. to be fair, ggg really fought it by making the skill tree more complicated with customised items but when they eventually did the right thing to employ the developer to stop him adapting the tool it´s been too late.

--

people rightfully complain that fighting monsters in poe2 feels like a slog but is it really because of in poe1 everything dies if you cough at it?

or is it the fact that every monster, the trees and soon every other entity like buildings in the game has a health bar?

--

ggg never really cared about what other games did, they reinvented and adapted other games´ mechanics and elements with a healthy knowledge of what makes sense for interesting gameplay. no gold, no auto pickup, no damage number pling pling, no bosses spawning in corners, no auto aiming ...

people did the old trick of calling poe a arpg and that typical arpgs need all those elements. the problem was ggg believing them over time instead of trusting their own sense (vision) of what belongs to a good game.

Saying that showing item stats or making mechanics more readable "killed the magic" feels more like gatekeeping than solid critique. If your enjoyment of the game depended on others not understanding the systems, was it really good design, or just obscurity? Accessibility doesn't remove depth — it just opens the door for more people to engage with it meaningfully.

Path of Building didn’t destroy theorycrafting — it elevated it. Sure, it lowered the barrier to entry, but it also enabled deeper min-maxing and planning than you could reasonably do by hand. Blaming a tool for trivializing builds is like blaming a calculator for making math less interesting. The problem isn’t the tool — it’s whether the underlying design still rewards creativity over raw numbers.

Complaining about overpowered builds being shared is just fighting the tide. It’s the internet age — information spreads fast. That’s not a design flaw or a moral failing, it’s a reality. The question isn’t "How do we stop sharing?" It’s "How do we make sure build variety and balance can survive sharing?"

If PoB can expose flaws in the game's design, then the issue was never the tool — it was that the game’s systems weren’t resilient to scrutiny. Good design shouldn't rely on opacity. If clarity kills creativity, then the systems weren't that creative to begin with.

And let’s not forget: build diversity is ultimately constrained by what the game actually offers — the pool of unique items, support gems, ascendancies, and mechanics. You can’t create a “clever” or “creative” build out of thin air if the tools don’t exist to support it. Path of Building didn’t narrow build variety — it just made the limitations more visible. If everyone flocks to the same builds, it’s not because the tool is bad — it’s because the game doesn't give enough viable or interesting alternatives.

On top of that, even the most creative or mechanically interesting build can be made completely unviable if the numbers don’t support it. You can have a build with perfect synergy, cool interactions, and satisfying gameplay — but if its damage output is too low compared to meta options, it’s dead on arrival. Balance isn’t just about raw power; it’s about keeping different playstyles functionally relevant. And when tuning swings too hard in one direction, players naturally gravitate to whatever actually works, not necessarily what’s most interesting. That’s not a community failure — that’s a balance issue.

Finally, the idea that “listening to the community too much is what ruined PoE1 for many of us” is fundamentally flawed — and honestly, a bit egotistical. The community isn’t a monolith. What you wanted preserved might be exactly what others found frustrating or inaccessible. Acting like your personal vision represents the "true" spirit of the game ignores the fact that PoE grew because it appealed to a wide range of players. Blaming the downfall on GGG listening to other players is just a way of saying they stopped listening to me. That’s not critique — that’s entitlement.

"

vio#1992 wrote:

power creep really hurt poe1 over the years but players running through content imho was just the symtom, the reason they were enabled to do so was the transparency ggg implemented into the game.

two examples:

1) their decision to show all item properties on pressing "alt" killed all the expert knowledge about how hybrid affixes interacted with single affixes, it took all the magic off itemisation.


2) the release of "path of building" killed build making by trivialising it and making it a simple hunt for more higher numbers rather than interesting skill combinations. it took all the magic away from making builds.
as a result, players asked for more damage rather than interesting skill interactions.

also it enabled the sharing of overpowered builds to the whole community in minutes. to be fair, ggg really fought it by making the skill tree more complicated with customised items but when they eventually did the right thing to employ the developer to stop him adapting the tool it´s been too late.

--

people rightfully complain that fighting monsters in poe2 feels like a slog but is it really because of in poe1 everything dies if you cough at it?

or is it the fact that every monster, the trees and soon every other entity like buildings in the game has a health bar?

--

ggg never really cared about what other games did, they reinvented and adapted other games´ mechanics and elements with a healthy knowledge of what makes sense for interesting gameplay. no gold, no auto pickup, no damage number pling pling, no bosses spawning in corners, no auto aiming ...

people did the old trick of calling poe a arpg and that typical arpgs need all those elements. the problem was ggg believing them over time instead of trusting their own sense (vision) of what belongs to a good game.

I think you outline a very important point here - players being able to google "top 15 builds for PoE" ruins the game.

You can't google your way out of mechanics, and that's how it should be.

PoE was always about making creative builds and finding creative solutions to push it further, not a calculator for highest DPS to erase the game's mechanics completely.

The mechanics in the game are there to be built AROUND not to be strong-armed by the player into NEVER OCCURRING because their build can just erase the boss or enemy NPC.

A lot of casuals in this community don't understand this, and my theory largely stands that even the people complaining in this very thread are those who did not play the original game, thusly they have no clue what we're on about.

I have no problem if someone started playing later on, but to pretend like PoE was just a zoom-zoom simulator is a disservice to the years of work that has gone into this product.

"

vio#1992 wrote:

people did the old trick of calling poe a arpg and that typical arpgs need all those elements. the problem was ggg believing them over time instead of trusting their own sense (vision) of what belongs to a good game.

And we can only speculate what would've happen if GGG really stuck to "their vision". I mean, forum trading?

No matter how we look at things, PoE has been a popular game for more than a decade, growing steady for all those years. I don't think many games can say that, especially if we look outside the PvP realm. Some may say they "went away from their vision", others may say the evolved with the times. Adapted. Whatever.

You can also say that the pace of PoE1 is one of a few factors that really makes it stand out from the crowd. PoE2 lacks that, but more severely it lacks the deep customization and freedom that PoE1 has. What does PoE2 have that really makes it stand out from the crowd?

GGG have ALWAYS experimented. NO ONE(!) asked for a tower defense mechanics in PoE1, but they added it. So I would say that they've absolutely gone their own way no matter what we "told them". Have the community influenced the game? Absolutely, but I would say for the better - but we will never know, only speculate. You can also ask; would people even play PoE1 today if the community wasn't so active and involved?

The community has asked for A LOT of stuff that we never got too. Why is that? I mean, XP penalty complaints? AH? Ground/on-death effects? They stand firm on certain things, open on others.

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

lol you want a hot take?

POE1 in its current state was not chris's original vision.

he wanted the game to be slow and deliberate.

the game is this way because he "listened to his customers".

his customers liked to break his game, finding powerful interactions that multiplied damage. he saw that his customers loved power.

he kept giving them more power. more speed. and added tougher and deadlier content to challenge the crazy amounts of power he gave them.

he sacrificed his game to make sure his company had money and could grow.

he will never say it but the poe1 that most people have grown to love is not exactly what he wanted.

poe2/poe1 ruthless is more of his vision.

Why did he leave then? Wouldn't he want to stay and see his vision come true?
I think he play tested it, saw how bad it was and dipped.

"

Chimmy81#7163 wrote:

Why did he leave then? Wouldn't he want to stay and see his vision come true?

He sold his shares years ago to Tencent, and it's only natural that he wasn't as driven after that. And PoE1 was always his baby, so when they decided to split it making PoE2 the main priority, he probably felt like he's given his all.

Just my thoughts, we'll never know unless he tells us.

"

vio#1992 wrote:

power creep really hurt poe1 over the years but players running through content imho was just the symtom, the reason they were enabled to do so was the transparency ggg implemented into the game.

two examples:

1) their decision to show all item properties on pressing "alt" killed all the expert knowledge about how hybrid affixes interacted with single affixes, it took all the magic off itemisation.


2) the release of "path of building" killed build making by trivialising it and making it a simple hunt for more higher numbers rather than interesting skill combinations. it took all the magic away from making builds.
as a result, players asked for more damage rather than interesting skill interactions.

also it enabled the sharing of overpowered builds to the whole community in minutes. to be fair, ggg really fought it by making the skill tree more complicated with customised items but when they eventually did the right thing to employ the developer to stop him adapting the tool it´s been too late.

--

people rightfully complain that fighting monsters in poe2 feels like a slog but is it really because of in poe1 everything dies if you cough at it?

or is it the fact that every monster, the trees and soon every other entity like buildings in the game has a health bar?

--

ggg never really cared about what other games did, they reinvented and adapted other games´ mechanics and elements with a healthy knowledge of what makes sense for interesting gameplay. no gold, no auto pickup, no damage number pling pling, no bosses spawning in corners, no auto aiming ...

people did the old trick of calling poe a arpg and that typical arpgs need all those elements. the problem was ggg believing them over time instead of trusting their own sense (vision) of what belongs to a good game.

i want to die reading this lmao guy actually saying not having to go trough multiple websites to get info on stuff to make a build or craft items and making the game more accessible for people by being able to easily share builds are bad things LMAO if you were in charge poe2 wouldn't exist because poe1 would never have been a huge success

"

hornfeld#7213 wrote:

I agree with everything op said. So many games have been ruined over the years because of vocal minorities whining on forums.

Well then maybe others need to speak up more often.

Or, perhaps the complainers aren't as "minority" as you like to imply.




Pick your poison, because by default, one of these has to be true here, if the overarching premise is to be granted.

"

Acaste7#4977 wrote:

I think you outline a very important point here - players being able to google "top 15 builds for PoE" ruins the game.

You can't google your way out of mechanics, and that's how it should be.

PoE was always about making creative builds and finding creative solutions to push it further, not a calculator for highest DPS to erase the game's mechanics completely.

The mechanics in the game are there to be built AROUND not to be strong-armed by the player into NEVER OCCURRING because their build can just erase the boss or enemy NPC.

A lot of casuals in this community don't understand this, and my theory largely stands that even the people complaining in this very thread are those who did not play the original game, thusly they have no clue what we're on about.

I have no problem if someone started playing later on, but to pretend like PoE was just a zoom-zoom simulator is a disservice to the years of work that has gone into this product.

People being able to google any top whatever today, as another guy pointed out, its not a balance or a design issue, its just a reality

You say cant google your way out of mechanics, thats how it should be , true, but thats how it actually is

You talk like erasing screens with a click is the rule, but i guarantee the vast majority of the players dont reach that point of progression, nor they aim to
And talking mechanics dont exist is actually exaggeration. Reaching that mark of dps takes some serious dedication so youll need to engage with mechanics at least when you are gearing up, and gearing up to truly get to a point you can ignore mechanics takes quite a while: Even 15m dps is not enough to truly negate mechanics. My hexblast miner have 23.5m and verisium mines are not safe. 15m is already a damage mark that is not exactly trivial to reach even if, yes, its easier than ever was to get there

And honestly, its true that PoE started as a rather slow game, but you also know what? The game was also far less popular. Poe started on 2013, but it only started to really pick up around 2018/19. At that period, the design was already moving towards speed with leagues like breach, legion and incursion that actively punished players that couldnt clear the screen fast enough

Youre right, the game didnt started as a particularly fast one, but i for one have absolutely no desire to return to the days red maps were a valuable find, atlas progression was an arduous slow affair and the meta was to skip the boss altogether because it was very time-ineffective

"

ShadyC#1006 wrote:

Well then maybe others need to speak up more often.

Or, perhaps the complainers aren't as "minority" as you like to imply.




Pick your poison, because by default, one of these has to be true here, if the overarching premise is to be granted.

It’s easy to assume that the most vocal voices represent the majority, but that’s not always the case, especially in gaming communities.

The truth is, the majority of players who aren't constantly complaining are either too busy actually playing the game, enjoying it, or simply don't feel the need to post every time something doesn't go their way. They exist and they're just not making noise 24/7 on forums or social media.

The vocal minority tends to dominate discussions because, by nature, frustration drives people to speak up more loudly and more often. But that doesn't mean their perspective is representative of the entire player base.

And let’s not forget, there are plenty of posts out there that offer solid, constructive feedback, interesting ideas, and thoughtful discussions. They just don't come packaged with the same negativity, frustration, unrealistic demands for sweeping changes, or the constant "game is dying" narratives that tend to grab more attention. Those calmer, more balanced voices are out there, they just don't shout as loud.

So yes, more people could speak up,but don’t mistake silence for agreement with the loudest voices.