3 TABLETS + 6 MODS = NO REVIVES = NO FUN. WHY GGG. THIS SUCKS BAD!!!

"Now we are forced to take a chance of losing all of our investment if we want to run the most rewarding content. It just feels really bad."

is not exactly saying the game is forcing 1-portal maps. so the "No one is forcing you to run 6 mod maps." arguments are moot

I am not forced to enter abyssal depths neither, so i don't enter them- if i wanted to enter such content i would make a HC char.

i don't even have beef with losing my investment, but kicking me out because i was playing a bit too risky or my defenses were not mitigating all hits including crit feels like shit. i enjoy dying occasionally thats why i play SC.

I had a tanky warrior in 0.2 and it was dull and boring so i would walk around the map gathering mobs and rares to make it fun- and yeah i would die due to that occasionally.

if i was in the middle of my 15min adventure and one mistake/unlucky chance and im out with no chance of trying again? i wont engage with that, so i support OP's feedback

there is always this dilemma going on between chosing to tryhard at the economy, goading yourself into playing the 2-3 builds, you don't like to play, to keep up with inflation.

or going ssf which lets you stare at that currency tab devoid of hinekora locks, perfect exalt, cool crafting omens, T0 uniques simply because those drop rates are not meant to serve a ssf player.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

I am not forced to enter abyssal depths neither, so i don't enter them- if i wanted to enter such content i would make a HC char.

To be clear, you should absolutely play the game in exactly the way that makes it most fun and rewarding for you personally.

That being said, I do feel some small compulsion to tell you that I think this is one of the worst risk-reward calculations I've ever seen anyone pull off in all my time playing this game or its predecessor. Like dude just don't stand in the green-ass shit and you'll be fine. These take moments to clear and between Omens of Light and Ancient bones you're missing out on a huge chunk of extra side income.

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Kerchunk#7797 wrote:

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

I am not forced to enter abyssal depths neither, so i don't enter them- if i wanted to enter such content i would make a HC char.

To be clear, you should absolutely play the game in exactly the way that makes it most fun and rewarding for you personally.

That being said, I do feel some small compulsion to tell you that I think this is one of the worst risk-reward calculations I've ever seen anyone pull off in all my time playing this game or its predecessor. Like dude just don't stand in the green-ass shit and you'll be fine. These take moments to clear and between Omens of Light and Ancient bones you're missing out on a huge chunk of extra side income.

the damage scaling of depths last rare when compared to the actual map is so high that if i would to spec into making it, as you put it, 'Like dude just don't stand in the green-ass shit and you'll be fine.' which even ignores the fact that the 'green shit' can be dropped on your head in a split second. if my char would be able to take this it would have made the entire map boring. so yeah hard pass

edit: that said you give me 2-3 portals in there i will be mashing my head against it every map, unless i need to level badly.

edit2: your take on this is exactly why poe2 doesn't feel like it promotes 'engaging combat' most solutions to 'difficulty' here is to make it not difficult. lol

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Gendono#6367 wrote:

there is always this dilemma going on between chosing to tryhard at the economy, goading yourself into playing the 2-3 builds, you don't like to play, to keep up with inflation.

or going ssf which lets you stare at that currency tab devoid of hinekora locks, perfect exalt, cool crafting omens, T0 uniques simply because those drop rates are not meant to serve a ssf player.

Bang on. There's just one more step after that. Then after playing SSF for a while, you start thinking, "This helmet with 2 T2 resistance mods is pretty good!" That's when you start enjoying the game.

tbh, locking the new "scarab" system behind 6 mods is kinda silly, they should just make them like poe 1 already and be done with it.

I agree that 0 revives as a penalty for running 6 mod maps is incredibly frustrating. You get quadruple punished for dying in these maps. You lose:
1) Experience, which at a high level (97+) should be punishment enough
2) You lose the waystone itself (which could be a lot depending on how juiced it is) and the time it took to curate it (getting the right roll, with the right rarity and rare monsters and pack size, desecrating the right thing, distilling it)
3) You lose league mechanics and affixes affecting it. Essentially killing its ability to give a meaningful amount of loot.
4) If it is on a path to somewhere you need to get to, you are being forced to rerun it just as a stepping stone to the next thing.
It just feels awful.

I cannot tell you the number of times where I have rolled my 50+ maps, and after the first 3-4 maps, I die. Then just afk in the hideout for the next hour out of sheer frustration.

The mapping system has arguably higher difficulty than POE1, plus you have a boss at the end of the map that are more mechanically complex than in POE 1, yet you only have 1/6th the number of attempts to complete the waystone. It feels like two design philosophies at odds with one another.

The main issue is that as you go from campaign to juiced end-game, it "feels" like the proportion of deaths dealt to you become increasingly via RNG of mod-stacking and less about your own mechanical mistakes (even if it usually is). Most times deaths feel unfair. Either you died to a ground mechanic that was obscured. You got an unlucky crit. You died to a mechanic that wasn't clearly telegraphed/poorly visually communicated such that you don't know what killed you, and so, don't know what to improve or do differently the next time.

I get that a game should have risk vs. reward. But it just feels horrible when, not only can you make zero mistakes in a map (which can be exhausting having to be that switched on for hours on end). But you are also contending with high spikes of modstacking rng.

You could argue, why not just run the waystones with fewer mods to get more revives. The opportunity cost is way too high to be running 5 mod maps with the amount of investment needed to get meaningful amounts of loot. So it almost feels like you are shoehorned into running 0 revive waystones.

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Oniji#5988 wrote:

The mapping system has arguably higher difficulty than POE1, plus you have a boss at the end of the map that are more mechanically complex than in POE 1

Yeah, I kind of think that's the idea. Despite what many diehards seem to think, PoE1 was not an especially challenging game. Sure it was complex to the point of being confusing, but once you figured it out you could trivialize the game to the point of being little more than an idle clicker.

As for your list:

#2 and #3 are the same thing; the "league mechanics and affixes" are part of the "Waystone itself."

#1 I'm just going to say come on, dude. Experience loss after 97 "should be punishment enough?" It's literally not a punishment at all. The difference between ~96 and 100 is essentially aesthetic.

#4 is a stretch; failing a node has absolutely no impact on the value of the nodes beyond it. They're still there, unaffected by your death.

So by my count your "quadruple punishment" is more like "one punishment" which is exactly the number one would expect to receive for one failure.

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Oniji#5988 wrote:

You could argue, why not just run the waystones with fewer mods to get more revives. The opportunity cost is way too high to be running 5 mod maps with the amount of investment needed to get meaningful amounts of loot.

That sure is true if your survival rate is equal between 5 and 6 mod maps which it's not or we wouldn't be having this conversation.

If you're going to trot out opportunity cost you need to factor in the impact of death at which point it becomes pretty immediately clear that for anyone who dies in 6-mod maps with any degree of regularity, running 5-mod maps consistently is going to net more loot in the long run.

I ‘ve found the solution for this, use headhunter for map clearing, and turn off atlas tree for bosses.

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Tatonka81#5058 wrote:

Ahh, responses from deadeye players. Figures.

Nah, this isn't a DE thing. I'm a DE and do all the DPS and I understand his feedback entirely. The critics in this thread are just fanboys.