T17s are still an overtuned mess that are also annoying to roll

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i didnt say i died to melee hits. it was the rotating beam that killed me. if i can tank kosis in wave 15 simu then i should be able to tank him too. these maps are just poorly balanced. i dont know why it always has to be the characters fault.

my friend plays the same build and he can tank everything even ghosted feared. he just has a MB and so he gets a ton more armor since his flask is always up.

I think that beam puts a stacking debuff on you or something. I feel like the game should make stuff like this more obvious, instead of killing you in 0.3 seconds because you touched the beam for a bit.

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i didnt say i died to melee hits. it was the rotating beam that killed me. if i can tank kosis in wave 15 simu then i should be able to tank him too. these maps are just poorly balanced. i dont know why it always has to be the characters fault.

my friend plays the same build and he can tank everything even ghosted feared. he just has a MB and so he gets a ton more armor since his flask is always up.

I mean you are doubling down on some false equivalency here. And you said phys up here so I just assumed you were talking about the only attacks that actualy have some physical damage behind them

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i have 90% phys dmg reduction and i think that boss does phys damage

And I cant tell what wave or what modifiers were on Kosis for that to even matter. So you are just repeating useless examples here as theres 0 context, along with no character being shown.


So the only thing you have to say is "its bad because its bad" with nothing to back it up. At least nothing tangible or data wise.


Hope you can actually provide something actionable, otherwise you are just leaving a blank statement with blank examples to provide why you blank dislike t17s.

"

And I cant tell what wave or what modifiers were on Kosis for that to even matter. So you are just repeating useless examples here as theres 0 context, along with no character being shown.


So the only thing you have to say is "its bad because its bad" with nothing to back it up. At least nothing tangible or data wise.


Hope you can actually provide something actionable, otherwise you are just leaving a blank statement with blank examples to provide why you blank dislike t17s.

The guy said wave 15 kosis, it probably had like 10 damage and bleed and impale mods stacked on it by then.

"

Toforto wrote:

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i didnt say i died to melee hits. it was the rotating beam that killed me. if i can tank kosis in wave 15 simu then i should be able to tank him too. these maps are just poorly balanced. i dont know why it always has to be the characters fault.

my friend plays the same build and he can tank everything even ghosted feared. he just has a MB and so he gets a ton more armor since his flask is always up.

I think that beam puts a stacking debuff on you or something. I feel like the game should make stuff like this more obvious, instead of killing you in 0.3 seconds because you touched the beam for a bit.

The beams stacking debuff is just action speed....

nothing to do with anything incoming damage wise...

"

Toforto wrote:

The guy said wave 15 kosis, it probably had like 10 damage and bleed and impale mods stacked on it by then.

Okay great its still a blank statement with a blank character, blank mods, and blank conclusions to draw from it. This is not actionable or even appropriate to use as a comparison.

"

Mashgesture wrote:

"

Toforto wrote:

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i didnt say i died to melee hits. it was the rotating beam that killed me. if i can tank kosis in wave 15 simu then i should be able to tank him too. these maps are just poorly balanced. i dont know why it always has to be the characters fault.

my friend plays the same build and he can tank everything even ghosted feared. he just has a MB and so he gets a ton more armor since his flask is always up.

I think that beam puts a stacking debuff on you or something. I feel like the game should make stuff like this more obvious, instead of killing you in 0.3 seconds because you touched the beam for a bit.

The beams stacking debuff is just action speed....

nothing to do with anything incoming damage wise...

Well then I have no idea, I've instantly died to that beam before lol, he just spins and deletes me. Maybe the beam gets damage from phys as ele mods on the map, maybe something else happened. Without a death recap there's really no way to know.

the point is that t17 are still overtuned...thats what the thread is about. a character that can go AFK in maps and tank wave 15 kosis should be able to tank t17 bosses also. if they designed these maps so people cant tank them then they should say so instead of saying that they double nerfed them...my friend can tank them but his gear is worth multiple mirrors.

"

Toforto wrote:

Well then I have no idea, I've instantly died to that beam before lol, he just spins and deletes me. Maybe the beam gets damage from phys as ele mods on the map, maybe something else happened. Without a death recap there's really no way to know.

Even if there was a death recap in this game, you have to have a properly built character to actually act on what you see.

Using your character for example; you have invested 0 into its defensive's to the point that it just falls over against anything.



So your perspective on balance comes from a place where you put 0 effort into defensive's but want the game to change somehow to that level.

This would be a disaster for balance unfortunately.


And the above users perspective comes from nothing, as they have provided no data and a comparison that also has no data behind it either. At least I could give you an answer here, but from Lyu theres no response really needed as theres nothing provided to act on.

They may not like t17s because they just dont like them, great. But they should stick to that rather than try to come up with any specifics on damage or mitigation as they cant even provide those details themselves.

i could post my pob but people would just nitpick at it because that is easier to do than admit that t17 are poorly balanced. my friend looked at it and said that the build is fine i just need more armor so i recover more ES when i block with aegis. if the build has issues with it then i would die elsewhere also not just t17 bosses.

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i could post my pob but people would just nitpick at it because that is easier to do than admit that t17 are poorly balanced. my friend looked at it and said that the build is fine i just need more armor so i recover more ES when i block with aegis. if the build has issues with it then i would die elsewhere also not just t17 bosses.

Hehe....if it is "easier to nitpick at it (pob) than admit t17 are poorly balanced"...then why haven't YOU nitpicked your own PoB to solve the issues it may have? Or could it be that you actually aren't as confident in your build's defenses as you like to say?

In order to determine that t17s are poorly balanced, the very FIRST thing that has to happen is to make sure that the build trying to tackle the content doesn't have very obvious deficiencies, such as Tof's builds. You really wanna be held in the same regard as his comments?

"It's poorly balanced because I SAY IT IS!"

I can't claim defenses don't work, while simultaneously running around with builds that have absolutely no defenses to speak of. Why should anyone else take me at my word because "it just is" when I've proven exactly the opposite?

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

i could post my pob but people would just nitpick at it because that is easier to do than admit that t17 are poorly balanced. my friend looked at it and said that the build is fine i just need more armor so i recover more ES when i block with aegis. if the build has issues with it then i would die elsewhere also not just t17 bosses.

Yea I mean you are free to believe that. Im not here to take away your opinions on t17s being bad because they are bad.

But you are having troubles with... the easiest t17 boss in the game so I highly doubt that your character has proper defensive's.

You can privately message me your pob and I wont share it on the forum if you want. Mods can act on that if I do as well.

Up to you to provide data or none when making claims though. So far there's just "my friend said this so believe its fine..."

Saying you dont die elsewhere really means nothing with 0 character information provided. Its just less data to go on, and more stories rather than anything actionable.


Up to you, PMS are open and everything!