Economy is such as trash now

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Problemkind1903#5180 wrote:

300% Rarity on items is like 2-3% more rarity than some1 with 100% Rarity. I think you are fired up by some streamers or reddit posts.

this is only true for currency, allegedly. for uniques rarity still matters at higher values

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Kaewis#5884 wrote:

I don't see what WoW has to do with PoE. But if I had to answer the question, I'd say it's a pay 2 fast because the bonus can be obtained by players who don't spend anything, it just takes them longer to achieve the same result.

A p2w provides a bonus that makes the character stronger, and this bonus cannot be obtained other than by paying.
It seems to me that this definition is quite correct.

Thanks for the tip about the forum, I'm kinda new to it.

no worries, tbf you shouldnt worry too much for people cutting the previous quotes out as there a 3 nested quote limit. so eventually it would happen. personally to me i find the most important thing is the conversation between the 2 individuals related to the quotings. if people cared enough about that conversation they would read the older messages to get context, and if one party is taking things out of context, we simply clarify ourselves.


as for how does WoW have anything to do with PoE, its actually simple. i want to know what you consider as P2W.

from what you told me, i actually disagree with your definition.

on surface level i would agree with you but i would say p2w should be anything that provides the player an advantage over a non paying player.

this is because for me, pay to "fast" is an in game advantage. imagine if we had that in poe. day 1 of new league start. if players could pay to immediately start at level 90, they could breeze thru the campaign at much faster speed and get to harder content much faster.

they would also be able to farm tougher content earlier and get a stronger foothold in the temp league's economy.

this is by your definition pay to fast. but isnt this actually pay to win? or would you maintain its just a pay to fast and they dont gain any advantage over other players?

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xMustard#3403 wrote:

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Problemkind1903#5180 wrote:

300% Rarity on items is like 2-3% more rarity than some1 with 100% Rarity. I think you are fired up by some streamers or reddit posts.

this is only true for currency, allegedly. for uniques rarity still matters at higher values

The average affix tier is 4.2 with 0 magic find and 4.3 with 300 magic find as per this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPu_jXKbKI8

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exsea#1724 wrote:

this is by your definition pay to fast. but isnt this actually pay to win? or would you maintain its just a pay to fast and they dont gain any advantage over other players?

Well, in the context of PoE with the start of a new league and the refresh of the economy, I would indeed consider that paying to reach level 90 day 1 would be P2W.

But this has no correlation with stash tabs (which were the main topic).

It's perfectly possible to progress all the way to the end game on PoE without paying a penny, it'll “just” be more painful in terms of QoL.

If we take the example of the start of a league with a new economy, having stash or not won't make much difference in the end (you can even find videos of “zero to hero” with blank accounts who nevertheless reach the very end game).

So I stand by my view that stash is more a matter of “pay to progress/fast” than P2W.

However, I understand that the subject is open to debate.

edit: After some thought, premium stash still seems essential for league play (excluding SSF/SSF HC ofc).

So I could consider it a form of “P2W” or rather “Pay to play” (which sounds more accurate to me).

However, if someone talks to me about a “P2W” game, I'd never think of POE as an example.

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Kaewis#5884 wrote:

Well, in the context of PoE with the start of a new league and the refresh of the economy, I would indeed consider that paying to reach level 90 day 1 would be P2W.

But this has no correlation with stash tabs (which were the main topic).


However, I understand that the subject is open to debate.

edit: After some thought, premium stash still seems essential for league play (excluding SSF/SSF HC ofc).

So I could consider it a form of “P2W” or rather “Pay to play” (which sounds more accurate to me).

However, if someone talks to me about a “P2W” game, I'd never think of POE as an example.

yeap

thats why in the earlier post i mention poe IS p2w but on a scale of 1-10 its 0.5 not even a "1".

its still p2w as much as we love the devs/games. just that the magnitude is low.

and i agree mostly that most people would not consider poe a p2w game but whenever i introduce poe to people i would say that its a free to play game and add that if you enjoy the game you're expected to buy a few preem tabs in order to fully enjoy the game.

i would not tell my friends poe is p2w directly but explain to them about the intricacies. if forced to say if its p2w or not, i would say yes it is but i will also point out its at a very low magnitude

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exsea#1724 wrote:

thats why in the earlier post i mention poe IS p2w but on a scale of 1-10 its 0.5 not even a "1".

its still p2w as much as we love the devs/games. just that the magnitude is low.

and i agree mostly that most people would not consider poe a p2w game but whenever i introduce poe to people i would say that its a free to play game and add that if you enjoy the game you're expected to buy a few preem tabs in order to fully enjoy the game.

i would not tell my friends poe is p2w directly but explain to them about the intricacies. if forced to say if its p2w or not, i would say yes it is but i will also point out its at a very low magnitude

Overall, I agree with you

These Farmers are the rulers of the market now.

They own the Divines
They own the best items.

If someone wants them they have to buy Divines for $ real money or the item.

Its simple.....

Only with real money its possible to get the 1st class Stuff from Trade.

Or in their web-Shops.....


All i ever found were 9 Divines since December 6th.... and i made ~1400 exalts..


So tell me how could i ever get a good 800 DPS QStaff for my L84 Monk if it costs 200-800 Divines??

Loot is horrible... yes ... 99.99999% is pure trash

Honestly i am old and patient. i do not care with passion like younger people do..

crazy that it took botters only a month of manipulating the market to fully ruin trading. now pure greed of players doing the rest. new players or people who have very spare time are now much more likely going to rmt cause it is impossible to grind enough currency for good gear. ggg could pull the break, but as we learned in poe 1 they just don't care. well played. playing ssf is the only way to avoid this junk and have a good time tbh.

This is 100% GGG's fault, no one else's. They designed a system ripe for abuse instead of providing a safe convenient way to trade, despite balancing the game around people buying gear instead of finding it.

This game is dead with this kind of thinking behind it.

Go look at any guide by any streamer. First step, 'go buy x,y, and z gear and destroy everything!'

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tuccos#0181 wrote:

If someone wants them they have to buy Divines for $ real money or the item.

Only with real money its possible to get the 1st class Stuff from Trade.

All i ever found were 9 Divines since December 6th.... and i made ~1400 exalts..

i promise you its not the case. i understand how you feel, how it must seem looking at the situation. but trust me m8, youre just not seeing how the economy works in this game.


we can talk about belton since he streams, everyone can see what hes doing. the guy can trade his way from almost nothing into literally 1000+ divines in a couple of days when hes crafting. 0 of them are coming from playing the game.


those 9 divines you found are almost completely irreverent. if you are trading almost all your divines come from trade.

say theres 10 players, they all find 9 divines in the past month. so theres 90 divines in this 10 man economy. one player gets all of them from trade, and then spends them so they go to other players, they spend them and they spread around... within a 24 period all 10 of those players could have spent 200 divines each despite there only being 90 divines in circulation and each person only finding 9 in the last month.



if you are playing and your budget is only what currency you pick up just randomly playing maps with no currency making strategy then essentially youre like a minimum wage worker in the economy making 20k a year.

how can you afford X thing that costs 400k? well you cant, but if you think the only people who can afford that are people who rob banks? no, people are legit making that much money.

there are people making that much money every week.

jeff bezos makes 190,000,000 a day.


this is the reality of economies.

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tuccos#0181 wrote:

So tell me how could i ever get a good 800 DPS QStaff for my L84 Monk if it costs 200-800 Divines??

by understanding the game way more. if you want great stuff from trade you have to become a great trader, that takes a lot of game knowledge. trade is a whole game in itself.

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Die_Scream#5464 wrote:

Go look at any guide by any streamer. First step, 'go buy x,y, and z gear and destroy everything!'

most of the top streamers are playing in solo self found hardcore.